Jump to content

The Protestant Community

Christian and Theologically Protestant? Or, sincerely inquiring about the Protestant faith? Welcome to Christforums the Christian Protestant community. You'll first need to register in order to join our community. Create or respond to threads on your favorite topics and subjects. Registration takes less than a minute, it's simple, fast, and free! Enjoy the fellowship! God bless, Christforums' Staff
Register now

Fenced Community

Christforums is a Protestant Christian forum, open to Bible- believing Christians such as Presbyterians, Lutherans, Reformed, Baptists, Church of Christ members, Pentecostals, Anglicans. Methodists, Charismatics, or any other conservative, Nicene- derived Christian Church. We do not solicit cultists of any kind, including Mormons, Jehovah's Witnesses, Eastern Lightning, Falun Gong, Unification Church, Aum Shinrikyo, Christian Scientists or any other non- Nicene, non- Biblical heresy.
Register now

Christforums

.... an orthodox (true and correct when contrasted with Liberal theology) Protestant forum whose members espouse the Apostolic doctrines in the Biblical theologies set forth by Augustine, Martin Luther, Ulrich Zwingli, John Calvin and John Knox etc. We do not "argue" with nor do we solicit the membership of people who espouse secular or cultic ideologies. We believe that our conversations are to be faith building and posts that advance heretical or apostate thinking will be immediately deleted and the poster permanently banned from the forum. This is a Christian Protestant community for people to explore the traditional theologies of Classical Protestantism.

Christian Fellowship

John Calvin puts forward a very simple reason why love is the greatest gift: “Because faith and hope are our own: love is diffused among others.” In other words, faith and hope benefit the possessor, but love always benefits another. In John 13:34–35 Jesus says, “A new command I give you: Love one another. As I have loved you, so you must love one another. By this everyone will know that you are my disciples, if you love one another.” Love always requires an “other” as an object; love cannot remain within itself, and that is part of what makes love the greatest gift.

Recommended Posts

How do you imagine Noah and his family functioned living in the ark?

For instance, how did they get rid of animal waste? What did carnivorous animals eat? How did they get water, air and light into the ark?

I'll start with how I think life went on the ark for a year.

 

The animal waste could have been pushed into a compartment in the floor to rot or maybe down through a hole to a compartment in the bottom of the ark, the gases from the waste could have been vented out by just a hollow space in the walls leading out to the top or even hallowed out bamboo as pipes. History records ancient civilizations useing bamboo as pipes thousands of years ago, I'm sure Noah could have done the same.

 

Carnivorous animals could have eaten cured meats and/or other animals slaugtered on the ark. They may have eaten fish, or they didn't eat meat at all. Dogs are carnivores, yet dog food is mostly made of corn.

 

How to get water into the ark? Back to those hallowed out bamboo pipes as menioned earlier. Noah likely had a way to run rain water into througs or maybe siphon the flood water. I don't think the flood water would be salty like the ocean, even if the oceans were salty, the water would be diluted. But it's possible that the oceans weren't salty yet, the salt comes from rain washing salt from the earth into the oceans, and it seems from Scripture that the flood was the first rain. (See Gen. 2:5-6)

 

Air. We're only told of one window on the ark, that doesn't necessarily mean that there was only one window, but we can't assume to much otherwise. That one window on top of the ark would have been enough.

The warm temperature of the animals and the cool temperature of the ark would have caused air to pull in though that window, and there was quite a weather forecast for the next 40 days, there was probably some wind, plus the flood waters rose the ark up higher than the mountain tops, the higher up you go, the stronger the wind.

 

As far as light, it's possible there were lamps powered by the gas put off from animal waste or there was an open section though the middle of the three floors of the ark. But the ark was probably a little dark inside, which would be a good thing. Darkness would keep the animals quiet, eating less and burning less energy.

 

A few other things to consider is that Noah's ark wasn't like a zoo, this was an emergency situation for the animals. Animals in captivity don't do much of anything and it's usually hard to get them to eat at first. Most of the animals were probably young.

    

  • Best Answer 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I will inject my unfounded opinion.

 

I propose God suspended what we consider the normal Laws of Science like He did in Duet.29:5 During the forty years I led you in the wilderness, neither your clothes nor the sandals on your feet wore out;

 

So, allegorically speaking, He stuck a cork in the animals mouths so they didn't have to eat  and  a cork in their butts so they didn't have to poop (or emit unpleasant odors); the lack of said by-product aiding Noah's comfort and suppressing his thoughts of abandoning ship.

  • Haha 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Fastfredy0 said:

I will inject my unfounded opinion.

 

I propose God suspended what we consider the normal Laws of Science like He did in Duet.29:5 During the forty years I led you in the wilderness, neither your clothes nor the sandals on your feet wore out;

 

So, allegorically speaking, He stuck a cork in the animals mouths so they didn't have to eat  and  a cork in their butts so they didn't have to poop (or emit unpleasant odors); the lack of said by-product aiding Noah's comfort and suppressing his thoughts of abandoning ship.

Well, I'm sure the ark would have never succeeded without the hand of God.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
11 hours ago, Innerfire89 said:

How do you imagine Noah and his family functioned living in the ark?

For instance, how did they get rid of animal waste? What did carnivorous animals eat? How did they get water, air and light into the ark?

I'll start with how I think life went on the ark for a year.

    

1.  There was, I believe, cross ventilation that helped tremendously.  Now to the Bible.  The Scriptures in Genesis 9 teach me that there were no Carnivores nor Omnivores but when the folks left the Ark, YHWH pronounced man would and could begin to eat flesh.  Reading Genesis 1-3 and 9 we learn that there was no death in the world before Adam followed Eve into Disobedience and Man was neither Carnivore nor Omnivore.  Then, all those animals, not nearly as many as unbelievers and false believers try to sell had to be there, did not try to devour one another, they ate the Dry Goods Adam had loaded and much the same as in the case of Elijah, the Widow and her son, the supply, through the miraculous power our Elohim, YHWH. (1 Kings 17: 7-16)

 

Now, remember, this is one old fossil writing and never forget, YHWH, our Elohim is Omnipotent, there is nothing to great for Him to do, nothing!  Poop?  Who sad they did?  This entire scenario is one miracle on top of another!  Without any attempt to be factious, Yashuah ha'Mashiah has not called us to attempt rationalization of what He has presented as fact, we are called to believe.

 

In the New Testament, Matthew 18:3, Yashuah said, "“Truly, I say to you, unless you turn and become like children, you will never enter the kingdom of heaven."  I battled with Him for more than 23 years before submitting and luckily I was first seated under a Biblicist Baptist Pastor that stressed and taught me to Eat the Scriptures and internalize them that I might learn to live by the Word of YHWH and for the first two years I drove my new wife nuts reading the scriptures until one or two in the morning, learning to love my Elohim because He loved me.  And I was one nasty bugger!  But remember your dad when you were a child?  Mine was in the Air Forge and was smarter than any General, tougher than Fighter and he never spoke anything that was not the absolute truth.  That, child-like faith is what we must seek to grasp and this blessing can belong to each of us if we pray and believe in YHWH.

 

Praying YHWH and Yashuah will bless their Word to your heart that you might, always be a Mighty Man of God.

  • Like 1
  • Best Answer 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Bill Taylor said:

The Scriptures in Genesis 9 teach me that there were no Carnivores nor Omnivores but when the folks left the Ark, YHWH pronounced man would and could begin to eat flesh.  Reading Genesis 1-3 and 9 we learn that there was no death in the world before Adam followed Eve into Disobedience and Man was neither Carnivore nor Omnivore.

Hello Bill, could you be more specific on the chapters and verses where you deduced all this?

 

5272.gif

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, deade said:

Hello Bill, could you be more specific on the chapters and verses where you deduced all this?

 

5272.gif

I'm sorry Deade, in most cases I would comply but in this case it's just not that simple.  A couple or more here have read my teaching and I am a Grizzly Bear when it comes to context.  Actually, I prefer to read from Genesis 3:1 thru Gen. 9 because it is the only way it makes complete sense to me.  Anything less and a lot of the feel is lost.  For the Normal Reader (not me} that is less than an hour and fourty-five minutes, given to our Creator, seeking His blessing.

 

Another thing, please, I did not deduce, conclude nor interpret anything.  I know, honest I know, that statement offends a great number of people so let me explain before some reading this deduct I am a pompous butt hole.  I was instructed by a Teacher that called neither of the two main camps to be his own but rather, he taught me to be as he is, a Biblicist.

 

A Biblicist will tell you, with a sincere face, that there are zero conflicting verses in the Holy Word of God!  We stand, flat-footed on the Word of God and strive every minu8te to leave the Old behind and to remember we are New Men or Women, not easy at all but if one will surrender everything, even their most treasured possessions, such as children to Yashuah ha'Mashiah and seek, with all their heart, soul, body and person it is a thing all of us can do.

 

If it says it in the Bible, I believe it in spite of my Human Self screaming, "But it is in conflict with Chapter 38 and verse such and such.  Yashuah ha'Mashia created everything that is on this planet, everything seen from this planet, the Space these planets and moons are suspended by Him in and He wrote/inspired the entire sixty-six books in the Christian Version of the Bible today.  And I am not the teacher I was before the Agent Orange Poisoning got serious about killing my brain, as little as it is.

 

But when our Humanity finds what we call a conflict it might be that we need to enjoy reading the book as if is our favorite author's latest and greatest or/and go before the Father through the Holy Spirit for guidance on how the passages fold together.  He has done that to me and given me the wisdom I sought through Him by doing Bible Studies from the Nave's Topical ad numerous other sources of studies.  In the end, the scriptures do not disagree but most often are either two related but different subjects and my simple mind could not see the differences.

 

Then there is my single rule of Hermeneutics is critical.

 

There is no single verse, collection of verses nor passage of Scripture that can be fully understood without the light of all scripture shinning down on it/them.

 

Follow that with only a fool will attempt to interpret scripture save from one language to another and then, only under the hand of Ruah (the Holy Spirit.

 

You see, by raping Scripture, jerking it out of context, one week I can prove the Earth is flat and the next week, using the same Bible, absolutely prove the earth is a circle.  Can be located by googling earth, flat or circle +Bible.  I pray you do the study.

  • Like 1
  • Best Answer 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
17 hours ago, Innerfire89 said:

What did carnivorous animals eat?

 

The same thing they did in Danil's den? :RpS_lol:

  • Love 1
  • Haha 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

image.png.6b80cbc5afb7983c78aeabaf07257453.png

https://www.pinterest.nz/pin/556757572668896723/

 

  • Like 1
  • Haha 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 6/2/2018 at 1:39 AM, Placable37 said:

image.png.6b80cbc5afb7983c78aeabaf07257453.png

https://www.pinterest.nz/pin/556757572668896723/

 

I once saw a cartoon like this except that the animals left behind were unicorns.

  • Haha 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Ever wonder where Chipmunks, bats, snakes and bears spend the winter?  Hint, it isn't Florida :classic_biggrin: they hibernate!  Several months before they go into hibernation they eat lots of food which will keep them alive for six or seven months.  Then when they find somewhere comfortable their body temperature decreases, their breathing slows, and their metabolic rate drops.  When spring comes they awake and come out of their resting place. If God does this for some animals today,  I have absolutely no problem believing He did this for all the animals in the ark for 12 months. All the problems of food, animal waste and smell are all gone.

 

Benji

  • Like 5

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

How did the kangaroos coming off the Ark get to Australia?

The "mountains of Ararat" seem to be modern-day Turkey.  Is it possible there was once a land-bridge such that Turkey and Australia were joined, and isn't it still odd that if kangaroos hopped all the way from Turkey to Australia, that there are now no kangaroos anywhere ELSE except Australia?

 

I don't think Man was a carnivore/omnivore until after the ark -- is it even possible that animals we now know to be carnivores did not become such until after the Ark?

 

I love the cartoon of the dinosaurs missing the Ark; I never heard that unicorns were substituted for dinosaurs in some versions of the cartoon...

 

It may be that Noah and family were the first meat-eating humans, also it may be that Noah was the first to drink alcohol, I know of nowhere that fermentation is addressed until Noah got drunk.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, Anto9us said:

I don't think Man was a carnivore/omnivore until after the ark -- is it even possible that animals we now know to be carnivores did not become such until after the Ark?

If that is the case, why was Noah instructed to bring the edible animals onto the ark by sevens (Gen. 7:2)?  :RpS_thumbup:

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

There's no telling how much the earth has changed since the time of the animals existing the ark, a land bridge sounds like a decent explanation. It's possible that kangaroos were brought there even.

 

I think it's possible that Noah was the first to discover alcohol by accident, when Noah became drunk the Bible only mentions Ham's sin, like maybe Noah's drunkenness wasn't held against him.

 God didn't bless the eating of animals till after the flood. Fruits and vegetables have a lot of health benefits, they were probably a lot more healthier back then..

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

There are somethings we are just not to know Deut. 29:29 I am just glad God found these people to replenish the Earth.

 

Consider that sea shells and fossils are found on the highest mountains, this proves not only the flood took place and was world wide, but our Earth has changes way beyond what we can imagine. God is just so awesome, I love Him more each day and so glad I am alive today to witness so much of what the Bible says of the Earth and its history. Doubters have no excuse of Gods existence as it says in Romans chapter one.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

As to WHY it was "one pair of unclean animals, seven pairs of clean animals" - I don't know - Ark was before the designations in Leviticus I think, not that God didn't tell Noah separately.  Maybe Noah, family and carnivores DID eat clean animals during the voyage -- there is much we will never know til later on.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
11 hours ago, deade said:

If that is the case, why was Noah instructed to bring the edible animals onto the ark by sevens (Gen. 7:2)?  :RpS_thumbup:

He didn't instruct him to bring edible animals, he instructed him to bring clean animals.  In the Mosaic law clean animals were those that could be eaten and were also suitable for sacrifices.  Before God authorized the eating of animals this designation simply meant they were acceptable for sacrifice.  One of the first things Noah did after the flood was to offer burnt offerings.

 

Then Noah built an altar to the Lord and took some of every clean animal and some of every clean bird and offered burnt offerings on the altar.

Genesis 8:20 ESV

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

That's a good point, theophilus -- and that's a whale of a lot of burnt offerings!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, Anto9us said:

As to WHY it was "one pair of unclean animals, seven pairs of clean animals" - I don't know - Ark was before the designations in Leviticus I think, not that God didn't tell Noah separately.  Maybe Noah, family and carnivores DID eat clean animals during the voyage -- there is much we will never know til later on.

 

What makes you think that God did not instruct Adam on the clean and unclean foods. Adam was taught by God personally. He, being a good father, pass on the oral instructions to his heirs. Everyone says that because the bible says we were given plants to eat that it was all we could eat.

 

in-deep-thought-smiley-emoticon.gif.d7a508a1012f2792e6117a0f5325b21b.gif

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Very possible that Adam was so instructed.

Bible says that originally we were given plants to eat - then after the flood we were given clean animals as well.

I try not to make it say more than it says.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The original diet probably lasted until the fall, a matter of  hours or days.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On ‎5‎/‎31‎/‎2018 at 10:51 PM, Innerfire89 said:

How do you imagine Noah and his family functioned living in the ark?

For instance, how did they get rid of animal waste? What did carnivorous animals eat? How did they get water, air and light into the ark?

I'll start with how I think life went on the ark for a year.

 

The animal waste could have been pushed into a compartment in the floor to rot or maybe down through a hole to a compartment in the bottom of the ark, the gases from the waste could have been vented out by just a hollow space in the walls leading out to the top or even hallowed out bamboo as pipes. History records ancient civilizations useing bamboo as pipes thousands of years ago, I'm sure Noah could have done the same.

 

Carnivorous animals could have eaten cured meats and/or other animals slaugtered on the ark. They may have eaten fish, or they didn't eat meat at all. Dogs are carnivores, yet dog food is mostly made of corn.

 

How to get water into the ark? Back to those hallowed out bamboo pipes as menioned earlier. Noah likely had a way to run rain water into througs or maybe siphon the flood water. I don't think the flood water would be salty like the ocean, even if the oceans were salty, the water would be diluted. But it's possible that the oceans weren't salty yet, the salt comes from rain washing salt from the earth into the oceans, and it seems from Scripture that the flood was the first rain. (See Gen. 2:5-6)

 

Air. We're only told of one window on the ark, that doesn't necessarily mean that there was only one window, but we can't assume to much otherwise. That one window on top of the ark would have been enough.

The warm temperature of the animals and the cool temperature of the ark would have caused air to pull in though that window, and there was quite a weather forecast for the next 40 days, there was probably some wind, plus the flood waters rose the ark up higher than the mountain tops, the higher up you go, the stronger the wind.

 

As far as light, it's possible there were lamps powered by the gas put off from animal waste or there was an open section though the middle of the three floors of the ark. But the ark was probably a little dark inside, which would be a good thing. Darkness would keep the animals quiet, eating less and burning less energy.

 

A few other things to consider is that Noah's ark wasn't like a zoo, this was an emergency situation for the animals. Animals in captivity don't do much of anything and it's usually hard to get them to eat at first. Most of the animals were probably young.

    

I have to agree with Kent Hovind  when asked about the animals on the ark and how long it took to load two of every kind of known species of animals , reptiles, birds , fish and etc . and how  they were cared for during their stay on the ark.   Kent brought up an interesting fact by mentioning that the animals were not fully mature . That makes a lot of sense when you think of the monumental task of caring for that many fully mature animals that Noah was ordered to take aboard the ark. It probably would have required a great deal of additional help to maintain a task that large. So I go with Hovind's opinion that the ark was filled with baby animals , reptiles , birds etc. . But we are only told that Noah ,his wife and their three sons and their wives were the only humans to board the ark. Additional passengers aren't mentioned in holy writ .      M

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, Matthew Duvall said:

I have to agree with Kent Hovind  when asked about the animals on the ark and how long it took to load two of every kind of known species of animals , reptiles, birds , fish and etc . 

  There were fish in the ark? lol.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On ‎9‎/‎25‎/‎2018 at 11:52 PM, Innerfire89 said:

  There were fish in the ark? lol.

That's interesting considering that if the fish weren't loaded on the ark they would have been swallowed up by the flood. Water types could have played a big roll since fresh water fish would have been subjected to salt water and vice versa.  I guess God had preservation in mind when He put the fish on the ark instead of having them fend for themselves in uncertain waters . 

Once in a while a tv special comes on that takes you to the site where the ark finally rested . Mount Ararat in modern day Turkey holds evidence of the landing . But since the preferred religion of Turkey is Islam the Turks discourage any further explorations that may compromise their beliefs . Facts are that hand hewn wood showed promising evidence that came from sites where the ark is said to rest . Probably a lot more to be discovered but the Turks are holding up any visitors from entering the mountain where the ark is .

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Matthew Duvall said:

That's interesting considering that if the fish weren't loaded on the ark they would have been swallowed up by the flood. Water types could have played a big roll since fresh water fish would have been subjected to salt water and vice versa.  I guess God had preservation in mind when He put the fish on the ark instead of having them fend for themselves in uncertain waters . 

Once in a while a tv special comes on that takes you to the site where the ark finally rested . Mount Ararat in modern day Turkey holds evidence of the landing . But since the preferred religion of Turkey is Islam the Turks discourage any further explorations that may compromise their beliefs . Facts are that hand hewn wood showed promising evidence that came from sites where the ark is said to rest . Probably a lot more to be discovered but the Turks are holding up any visitors from entering the mountain where the ark is .

I'm not so sure there were fish on the ark, I've never heard that one before. I could imagine a few different possibites for the fish.

 

One would be that there were no fresh water fish till after the flood.

 

Another would be that the water was diluted enough for fresh water fish to survive. 

 

And another, the fresh water fish just died and the fresh water fish we have today are adapted variations of salt water fish.

 

And the last one. The oceans weren't that salty yet, it's possible that the flood was the first rain. The oceans get there salt from the earth via rain and  its waves, so it took time for the ocean to become salty. 

 

I don't see how it would be possible to have fish on the ark.

 

But that's interesting to think about.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.

×
Articles - News - Registration Terms