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islandrazor

Physician asssisted suicide

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Hawaii has become the eighth state to legalize Physician assisted suicide. Does this line up with scripture? What are the pitfalls of allowing this option?

 

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I see it like I see abortion, no one has the right to set their own value for human life.

 

To help someone kill themself you would first have to judge that their life is no longer of enough value.

 

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Reminds me of the Japanese Samurai which committed honor suicides.

 

 

image_2014.jpg.4f31dd3831054dff2f55f409e14d886d.jpg

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Reminds me of the Japanese Samurai which committed honor suicides.

 

 

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I see in the youtube video the guy was assisted. But where was that other poor fellows help. That's gotta hurt. Someone is going to point out to me how truly unfunny I am for that comment.

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Hawaii has become the eighth state to legalize Physician assisted suicide. Does this line up with scripture? What are the pitfalls of allowing this option?

 

I'm not sure there is an easy answer to that question - I guess I would start Gen 9:6 which basis the preciousness of human life on the realty that we are all made in the image of God. I believe the bible allows us (even instructs us) to take a human life on certain occasions (capital punishment for example) I don't find 'assisted suicide' as one of those exclusion clauses - in fact suicide itself is to break the 10 commandments and should therefore be considered sinful - i don't believe it is right to assist someone in taking their own lives.

 

I also wonder how doctor's would justify doing such a thing whilst consistinetly holding to their hypocratic oath.

 

However, that been said this is one of those emotive subjects that is likely to generate a lot of heat - and my heart goes out to those who are in such pain and suffering that they feel they need to end their lives. I would, if I could, share the hope of Jesus Christ with them so that they might have an anchor for their souls and a sure and certain hope to rest in.

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Hawaii has become the eighth state to legalize Physician assisted suicide. Does this line up with scripture? What are the pitfalls of allowing this option?

 

I'm not sure there is an easy answer to that question - I guess I would start Gen 9:6 which basis the preciousness of human life on the realty that we are all made in the image of God. I believe the bible allows us (even instructs us) to take a human life on certain occasions (capital punishment for example) I don't find 'assisted suicide' as one of those exclusion clauses - in fact suicide itself is to break the 10 commandments and should therefore be considered sinful - i don't believe it is right to assist someone in taking their own lives.

 

I also wonder how doctor's would justify doing such a thing whilst consistinetly holding to their hypocratic oath.

 

However, that been said this is one of those emotive subjects that is likely to generate a lot of heat - and my heart goes out to those who are in such pain and suffering that they feel they need to end their lives. I would, if I could, share the hope of Jesus Christ with them so that they might have an anchor for their souls and a sure and certain hope to rest in.

Thoughtful and judicious comment Reformed. Personally I feel assisted suicide is against God. Scripture tells us;

Hebrews 11:36 And others had trial of cruel mockings and scourgings, yea, moreover of bonds and imprisonment: They were stoned, they were sawn asunder, were tempted, were slain with the sword: they wandered about in sheepskins and goatskins; being destitute, afflicted, tormented; (Of whom the world was not worthy:) they wandered in deserts, and in mountains, and in dens and caves of the earth.

And these all, having obtained a good report through faith, received not the promise: God having provided some better thing for us, that they without us should not be made perfect.

Wherefore seeing we also are compassed about with so great a cloud of witnesses, let us lay aside every weight, and the sin which doth so easily beset us, and let us run with patience the race that is set before us, Looking unto Jesus the author and finisher of our faith; who for the joy that was set before him endured the cross, despising the shame, and is set down at the right hand of the throne of God.

 

Pain is difficult to quantify, which is partially responsible for the over prescription of opioids. The reasons I read for assisted suicide seem to resemble those spoken of above; destitute, afflicted, tormented, and yet they were referred to as a great cloud of witnesses for enduring.

 

From, of all places CNN:

A recent report from the Institute of Medicine calls the country's system of caring for terminally ill people "largely broken," "poorly designed to meet the needs of patients" and refers to Medicare and Medicaid, health care systems designed to meet the needs of the poorest among us, "in need of major reorientation and restructuring."

The idea of mixing a cost-cutting "treatment" such as assisted suicide into a broken, cost-conscious health care system that's poorly designed to meet dying patient's needs is dangerous to the thousands of people whose health care costs the most -- mainly people living with a disability, the elderly and chronically ill.

Assisted suicide drugs cost less than $300. Compare that with the cost of treating a terminal illness. This is one of the many reasons every major disability rights organization in the country that has taken a position on assisted suicide is opposed to legalization, along with the American Medical Association, palliative care specialists and hospice workers who know better than anyone that advancements in palliative care have eliminated pain as an issue for patients who receive appropriate care.

http://www.cnn.com/2014/11/03/opinion/coleman-assisted-suicide/index.html

 

In Christ

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Luke 10:30 30 In reply Jesus said: “A man was going down from Jerusalem to Jericho, when he was attacked by robbers. They stripped him of his clothes, beat him and went away, leaving him half dead. 31 A priest happened to be going down the same road, and when he saw the man, he passed by on the other side. 32 So too, a Levite, when he came to the place and saw him, passed by on the other side. 33 But a Samaritan, as he traveled, came where the man was; and when he saw him, he took pity on him. 34 He went to him and bandaged his wounds, pouring on oil and wine. Then he put the man on his own donkey, brought him to an inn and took care of him. 35 The next day he took out two denarii and gave them to the innkeeper. ‘Look after him,’ he said, ‘and when I return, I will reimburse you for any extra expense you may have.’

 

Now my guess is that having being beat half to death, he was in considerable pain. I’m relatively certain he was rather depressed and feeling hopeless after having two “Good” men neglect him. Yet the one man Christ considered a neighbor with the Samaritans best interest in mind was the one who provided assistance and comfort.

 

While there is plenty death in scripture, I don’t recall stories of Godly men helping anyone kill themselves. We seem to be called to comforting and healing. Now I know not all can be healed, but there is no comfort in death, by it’s nature. It is a cessation of life in which there is no awareness.

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When I think about assisted suicide I think about king Saul. He asked for assistance after leaning on his own spear. Saul tried to commit suicide in order to escape torture or great pain.

  • 2 Samuel 1:6 And the young man who told him said, “By chance I happened to be on Mount Gilboa, and there was Saul leaning on his spear, and behold, the chariots and the horsemen were close upon him.
  • 2 Samuel 1:9 And he said to me, ‘Stand beside me and kill me, for anguish has seized me, and yet my life still lingers.’
  • 2 Samuel 1:10 So I stood beside him and killed him, because I was sure that he could not live after he had fallen. And I took the crown that was on his head and the armlet that was on his arm, and I have brought them here to my lord.”

God bless,

William

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Hawaii has become the eighth state to legalize Physician assisted suicide. Does this line up with scripture? What are the pitfalls of allowing this option?

 

I'm not sure there is an easy answer to that question - I guess I would start Gen 9:6 which basis the preciousness of human life on the realty that we are all made in the image of God. I believe the bible allows us (even instructs us) to take a human life on certain occasions (capital punishment for example) I don't find 'assisted suicide' as one of those exclusion clauses - in fact suicide itself is to break the 10 commandments and should therefore be considered sinful - i don't believe it is right to assist someone in taking their own lives.

 

I also wonder how doctor's would justify doing such a thing whilst consistinetly holding to their hypocratic oath.

 

However, that been said this is one of those emotive subjects that is likely to generate a lot of heat - and my heart goes out to those who are in such pain and suffering that they feel they need to end their lives. I would, if I could, share the hope of Jesus Christ with them so that they might have an anchor for their souls and a sure and certain hope to rest in.

Quit calling that "Particular" Baptist Reformed. Doh, j/king.

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When I think about assisted suicide I think about king Saul. He asked for assistance after leaning on his own spear. Saul tried to commit suicide in order to escape torture or great pain.

  • 2 Samuel 1:6 And the young man who told him said, “By chance I happened to be on Mount Gilboa, and there was Saul leaning on his spear, and behold, the chariots and the horsemen were close upon him.
  • 2 Samuel 1:9 And he said to me, ‘Stand beside me and kill me, for anguish has seized me, and yet my life still lingers.’
  • 2 Samuel 1:10 So I stood beside him and killed him, because I was sure that he could not live after he had fallen. And I took the crown that was on his head and the armlet that was on his arm, and I have brought them here to my lord.”

God bless,

William

I don't get the impression Saul was in God's favor. And David was not pleased at all with that young man since he killed him for doing it.

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When I think about assisted suicide I think about king Saul. He asked for assistance after leaning on his own spear. Saul tried to commit suicide in order to escape torture or great pain.

  • 2 Samuel 1:6 And the young man who told him said, “By chance I happened to be on Mount Gilboa, and there was Saul leaning on his spear, and behold, the chariots and the horsemen were close upon him.
  • 2 Samuel 1:9 And he said to me, ‘Stand beside me and kill me, for anguish has seized me, and yet my life still lingers.’
  • 2 Samuel 1:10 So I stood beside him and killed him, because I was sure that he could not live after he had fallen. And I took the crown that was on his head and the armlet that was on his arm, and I have brought them here to my lord.”

God bless,

William

Definitely agree with you. Saul is not an example to follow in Scripture. Just stating that this is the first place I came across where I thought, hey, this is euthanasia.

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Just one more comment then off to bed.

I may be wrong, however consider this: When the young man who assisted Saul walked in and told David, "I stood beside him and killed him", Was he aware he was flirting with death? And did David in essence assist him in his dangerously suicidal behavior?

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Hawaii has become the eighth state to legalize Physician assisted suicide. Does this line up with scripture? What are the pitfalls of allowing this option?

 

I'm not sure there is an easy answer to that question - I guess I would start Gen 9:6 which basis the preciousness of human life on the realty that we are all made in the image of God. I believe the bible allows us (even instructs us) to take a human life on certain occasions (capital punishment for example) I don't find 'assisted suicide' as one of those exclusion clauses - in fact suicide itself is to break the 10 commandments and should therefore be considered sinful - i don't believe it is right to assist someone in taking their own lives.

 

I also wonder how doctor's would justify doing such a thing whilst consistinetly holding to their hypocratic oath.

 

However, that been said this is one of those emotive subjects that is likely to generate a lot of heat - and my heart goes out to those who are in such pain and suffering that they feel they need to end their lives. I would, if I could, share the hope of Jesus Christ with them so that they might have an anchor for their souls and a sure and certain hope to rest in.

Lol - I would call myself 'particular baptist' if I didn't get so many 'eh - what's that, some sort of cult' comments :D

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When I think about assisted suicide I think about king Saul. He asked for assistance after leaning on his own spear. Saul tried to commit suicide in order to escape torture or great pain.

  • 2 Samuel 1:6 And the young man who told him said, “By chance I happened to be on Mount Gilboa, and there was Saul leaning on his spear, and behold, the chariots and the horsemen were close upon him.
  • 2 Samuel 1:9 And he said to me, ‘Stand beside me and kill me, for anguish has seized me, and yet my life still lingers.’
  • 2 Samuel 1:10 So I stood beside him and killed him, because I was sure that he could not live after he had fallen. And I took the crown that was on his head and the armlet that was on his arm, and I have brought them here to my lord.”

God bless,

William

The Amalekite was lying to try and find favour with David - in 1 Sam 31:4 we are told Saul killed himself, after his armor bearer refused to assist him.

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When I think about assisted suicide I think about king Saul. He asked for assistance after leaning on his own spear. Saul tried to commit suicide in order to escape torture or great pain.

  • 2 Samuel 1:6 And the young man who told him said, “By chance I happened to be on Mount Gilboa, and there was Saul leaning on his spear, and behold, the chariots and the horsemen were close upon him.
  • 2 Samuel 1:9 And he said to me, ‘Stand beside me and kill me, for anguish has seized me, and yet my life still lingers.’
  • 2 Samuel 1:10 So I stood beside him and killed him, because I was sure that he could not live after he had fallen. And I took the crown that was on his head and the armlet that was on his arm, and I have brought them here to my lord.”

God bless,

William

Yeah, the little turkey was trying to gain points.

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I got into a debate a long time ago when the Terri Schiavo issue was in the news. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Terri_Schiavo_case

 

 

 

I've had some discussions where the issue turned from a vegetative state to one of constant horrible pain and I've asked myself this question. Would I to save a person from committing assisted suicide because of unbearable pain take that pain from the person and place it within our own bodies in order to save him from having to make that choice?

 

I know my feelings on suicide as it is a sin against God and one I can not repent from, because I would be dead and it would be too late for me. I have, before finding God had gone through the motions of gathering the equipment to end my life, but thank God I did not go through with it. I know now that the Lord was looking out for me, but the question I've ask myself I ask you to contemplate.

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Posted (edited)
I got into a debate a long time ago when the Terri Schiavo issue was in the news. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Terri_Schiavo_case

 

 

 

I've had some discussions where the issue turned from a vegetative state to one of constant horrible pain and I've asked myself this question. Would I to save a person from committing assisted suicide because of unbearable pain take that pain from the person and place it within our own bodies in order to save him from having to make that choice?

 

I know my feelings on suicide as it is a sin against God and one I can not repent from, because I would be dead and it would be too late for me. I have, before finding God had gone through the motions of gathering the equipment to end my life, but thank God I did not go through with it. I know now that the Lord was looking out for me, but the question I've ask myself I ask you to contemplate.

I've considered the same and at the time It felt like an honest response. It may have been influenced by the knowledge that no such thing would possibly occur. You seem deeply sincere, so I don't doubt if such an transfer were possible that you would not have hesitated. Me, I may have in essence just been blowing smoke.

Edited by islandrazor

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In today's world of medical miracles while filling out the Advance Directives.. (This is a form that says what to do with heroic medicine in California) my mind pondered this style of question.. We both opted for no herorics .. I wonder where that leaves us?

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In today's world of medical miracles while filling out the Advance Directives.. (This is a form that says what to do with heroic medicine in California) my mind pondered this style of question.. We both opted for no herorics .. I wonder where that leaves us?

To die of natural causes? That is not suicide.

 

In Christ

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In today's world of medical miracles while filling out the Advance Directives.. (This is a form that says what to do with heroic medicine in California) my mind pondered this style of question.. We both opted for no herorics .. I wonder where that leaves us?

 

I take it you prefer no resuscitation. I follow that ideal.

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My husband is facing multible myeloma so this stuff is fresh in our minds..

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My husband is facing multible myeloma so this stuff is fresh in our minds..

Becky, God bless you and your husband as you navigate these challenges.

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Not everything is black and white (suicide, assisted suicide - the act or an instance of taking one's own life voluntarily and intentionally)

 

I can think of circumstances in which I would ethically sympathetic/persuaded to support suicide/assisted suicide:

1) a DNR (yes, you can argue that it is natural ... Suicide by using natural causes is still suicide if there are means to prevent death)

2) Someone is going to die with 100% surety but will be tortured first. Skipping the torture interval of life seems sensible.

3) To protect/save others ... The spy novels have a person taking a poison pill. (Patriot) Another person throws himself on a grenade. (Medal of Honor recipients) Another dies as a ransom for many. (Jesus?)

4) A form of protest or to stand up for one's convictions .... a killer comes into the church and tells all non believers to leave, the remaining people he will kill. (Peter?)

 

 

 

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Not everything is black and white (suicide, assisted suicide - the act or an instance of taking one's own life voluntarily and intentionally)

 

I can think of circumstances in which I would ethically sympathetic/persuaded to support suicide/assisted suicide:

1) a DNR (yes, you can argue that it is natural ... Suicide by using natural causes is still suicide if there are means to prevent death)

2) Someone is going to die with 100% surety but will be tortured first. Skipping the torture interval of life seems sensible.

3) To protect/save others ... The spy novels have a person taking a poison pill. (Patriot) Another person throws himself on a grenade. (Medal of Honor recipients) Another dies as a ransom for many. (Jesus?)

4) A form of protest or to stand up for one's convictions .... a killer comes into the church and tells all non believers to leave, the remaining people he will kill. (Peter?)

 

 

I wouldn't put the voluntary sacrifice of ones life to save others in the category of suicide - would suggest that these examples (with the exception on point 1) are living out preciousness of human life to the ultimate degree - giving your life for another!

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Not everything is black and white (suicide, assisted suicide - the act or an instance of taking one's own life voluntarily and intentionally)

 

I can think of circumstances in which I would ethically sympathetic/persuaded to support suicide/assisted suicide:

1) a DNR (yes, you can argue that it is natural ... Suicide by using natural causes is still suicide if there are means to prevent death)

2) Someone is going to die with 100% surety but will be tortured first. Skipping the torture interval of life seems sensible.

3) To protect/save others ... The spy novels have a person taking a poison pill. (Patriot) Another person throws himself on a grenade. (Medal of Honor recipients) Another dies as a ransom for many. (Jesus?)

4) A form of protest or to stand up for one's convictions .... a killer comes into the church and tells all non believers to leave, the remaining people he will kill. (Peter?)

 

 

I wouldn't put the voluntary sacrifice of ones life to save others in the category of suicide

That's why I added a definition ... the act or an instance of taking one's own life voluntarily and intentionally. I think the examples fit the definition.

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