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islandrazor

Do gun laws prevent murder?

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Following are the New York State gun laws.

From the NRA website, Here; https://www.nraila.org/gun-laws/stat...laws/new-york/ [TABLE=class: gun_laws_overview]

 

England has some of the most stringent gun laws in the world.

Here is the murder rate for February in London. Taken from the Evening Standard, https://www.standard.co.uk/news/crim...-a3803566.html

 

"London's murder rate has overtaken New York City's for the first time ever, according to a new report.

 

February marked the first month the UK capital saw more murders than New York, with 15 dead (nine aged 30 or younger).

 

According to the report in the Sunday Times, London also suffered 22 fatal stabbings and shootings in March, higher than the 21 in the Big Apple".

 

While it may be more convenient to kill with a gun, it doesn't seem to diminish the desire to do so.

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Yes Brother, people kill and wound other people. Guns alone kill no one. The hear of man is desperately wicked and evil. Jesus Christ came that we might have LIFE and have it abundantly Praise God, He has risen!

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Wars were fought with swords at one time, things like switch blades, butterfly knifes, and brass knuckles are illegal in most US States, the weapons available make no difference except to law abiding citizens who can't have them anymore.

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cain did not have a gun

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islandrazor said:
Following are the New York State gun laws.

From the NRA website, Here; https://www.nraila.org/gun-laws/stat...laws/new-york/ [TABLE=class: gun_laws_overview]

 

England has some of the most stringent gun laws in the world.

Here is the murder rate for February in London. Taken from the Evening Standard, https://www.standard.co.uk/news/crim...-a3803566.html

 

"London's murder rate has overtaken New York City's for the first time ever, according to a new report.

 

February marked the first month the UK capital saw more murders than New York, with 15 dead (nine aged 30 or younger).

 

According to the report in the Sunday Times, London also suffered 22 fatal stabbings and shootings in March, higher than the 21 in the Big Apple".

 

While it may be more convenient to kill with a gun, it doesn't seem to diminish the desire to do so.

 

good point - gun laws only leave law abiding citizens at the mercy of criminals

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cain did not have a gun

That for some reason made me laugh.

And he put the murder rate up to 25%

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Only the deluded believe that banning guns prevents any crime. For example the Russian Target and his daughter were not attacked in England with a gun, knife nor a sword. They were attacked with some form of nerve gas and likely in a public venue. VX, Nerve Gas smells like peaches and a being has 9 seconds to inject themselves with Atropine or to bend over and kiss their behind Bye Bye. After nine seconds a being is not recoverable if they received a lethal dose.

 

In the sixties a Colonel wanted to see a demonstration of VX Gas ad stood over 100 foot up wind of the Goats they were gassing and because of his being so far upwind he refused a Gas Mask. He drove home from the site and as soon as he arrived at his On Post Quarters his wife called the ambulance to pick him up. I believe I recall that it took three weeks for him to recover from just a remote whiff of the VX. Guns do not affect the rate of men murdering men.

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islandrazor said:
Following are the New York State gun laws.

From the NRA website, Here; https://www.nraila.org/gun-laws/stat...laws/new-york/ [TABLE=class: gun_laws_overview]

 

England has some of the most stringent gun laws in the world.

Here is the murder rate for February in London. Taken from the Evening Standard, https://www.standard.co.uk/news/crim...-a3803566.html

 

"London's murder rate has overtaken New York City's for the first time ever, according to a new report.

 

February marked the first month the UK capital saw more murders than New York, with 15 dead (nine aged 30 or younger).

 

According to the report in the Sunday Times, London also suffered 22 fatal stabbings and shootings in March, higher than the 21 in the Big Apple".

 

While it may be more convenient to kill with a gun, it doesn't seem to diminish the desire to do so.

 

well, that's one way to misuse statistics

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Posted (edited)

It's pretty wild that liberals want all this freedom of action for people. They tell us, over and over how we are supposed to not be judgemental on everyone, yet they want to restrict the instrumentation that these people use, because a certain segment of that population, that we are supposed to not be judgmental of misuse the items they can acquire.

 

Then they place the responsibility for doing background checks in the hands of those very people (The authorities) they have been skeptical about for as long as I can remember. In the Florida case, they were correct, because of sheer cowardliness, but did they even take a look at the police? No. they went directly after the gins and then the perp, in that order.

 

What it sounds like to me is irresponsible people who want others to clean up the mess they made, so if something does go wrong, in the meanwhile they can blame others instead of taking the responsibility for the absence of morality that's lead our society down the path of abject hedonism and ti value the individual above all else. They've cheapened the value of human life to a matter of convenience.

 

The idea of personal sacrifice is a punchline in a joke to them, which is why they are so dumbfounded at people who volunteer to take a bullet for another. Look at how they see the military. Look at how they see the police. enough said.

 

I look so much for the end times to get here and the rapture to take us away from all this wickedness and bring us into God's bosom. This place makes my heart ache

Edited by just_me
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Doesn't California have strict gun laws?

 

I was wondering because of the tragic shooting at a YouTube Office there.

 

http://www.oann.com/developing-shots...e-hq-in-calif/

RIFLES & SHOTGUNS HANDGUNS

Permit to Purchase Yes* Yes*

Registration of Firearms Yes** Yes**

Permit to possess registered "Assault Weapons" No No

Licensing of Owner No No

Permit to Carry No Yes (in incorporated areas and concealed anywhere)

 

 

STATE STATUS

Castle Doctrine No Law

No-Net Loss No Legislation

Right to Carry Confidentiality No Provisions

Right to Carry in Restaurants Partial Ban

Right To Carry Laws Rights Restricted-Very Limited Issue

Right To Carry Reciprocity and Recognition None

Right to Keep & Bear Arms State Constitutional Provisions No Provisions

 

California Department of Justice, Bureau of Firearms: http://ag.ca.gov/firearms/index.php

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Following are the New York State gun laws.

From the NRA website, Here; https://www.nraila.org/gun-laws/stat...laws/new-york/ [TABLE=class: gun_laws_overview]

[TR]

[/TR]

[TR]

[TD=class: title]Permit to Purchase[/TD]

[TD]No*[/TD]

[TD]Yes[/TD]

[/TR]

[TR]

[TD=class: title]Registration of Firearms[/TD]

[TD]No*[/TD]

[TD]Yes[/TD]

[/TR]

[TR]

[TD=class: title]Licensing of Owners[/TD]

[TD]No*[/TD]

[TD]Yes[/TD]

[/TR]

[TR]

[TD=class: title]Permit to Carry[/TD]

[TD]No*[/TD]

[TD]Yes[/TD]

[/TR]

[TR]

[TD=class: caveats, colspan: 3]* Except in New York City.[/TD]

[/TR]

[/TABLE]

 

England has some of the most stringent gun laws in the world.

Here is the murder rate for February in London. Taken from the Evening Standard, https://www.standard.co.uk/news/crim...-a3803566.html

 

"London's murder rate has overtaken New York City's for the first time ever, according to a new report.

 

February marked the first month the UK capital saw more murders than New York, with 15 dead (nine aged 30 or younger).

 

According to the report in the Sunday Times, London also suffered 22 fatal stabbings and shootings in March, higher than the 21 in the Big Apple".

 

While it may be more convenient to kill with a gun, it doesn't seem to diminish the desire to do so.

 

well, that's one way to misuse statistics

You're in London, right? Rofl

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Following are the New York State gun laws.

From the NRA website, Here; https://www.nraila.org/gun-laws/stat...laws/new-york/ [TABLE=class: gun_laws_overview]

[TR]

[/TR]

[TR]

[TD=class: title]Permit to Purchase[/TD]

[TD]No*[/TD]

[TD]Yes[/TD]

[/TR]

[TR]

[TD=class: title]Registration of Firearms[/TD]

[TD]No*[/TD]

[TD]Yes[/TD]

[/TR]

[TR]

[TD=class: title]Licensing of Owners[/TD]

[TD]No*[/TD]

[TD]Yes[/TD]

[/TR]

[TR]

[TD=class: title]Permit to Carry[/TD]

[TD]No*[/TD]

[TD]Yes[/TD]

[/TR]

[TR]

[TD=class: caveats, colspan: 3]* Except in New York City.[/TD]

[/TR]

[/TABLE]

 

England has some of the most stringent gun laws in the world.

Here is the murder rate for February in London. Taken from the Evening Standard, https://www.standard.co.uk/news/crim...-a3803566.html

 

"London's murder rate has overtaken New York City's for the first time ever, according to a new report.

 

February marked the first month the UK capital saw more murders than New York, with 15 dead (nine aged 30 or younger).

 

According to the report in the Sunday Times, London also suffered 22 fatal stabbings and shootings in March, higher than the 21 in the Big Apple".

 

While it may be more convenient to kill with a gun, it doesn't seem to diminish the desire to do so.

 

well, that's one way to misuse statistics

About an hour away - I'm not commenting on the current gun 'debate' in the USA (that isn't my place) however this is an appalling misuse of statistics to try and make a point.

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It's pretty wild that liberals want all this freedom of action for people. They tell us, over and over how we are supposed to not be judgemental on everyone, yet they want to restrict the instrumentation that these people use, because a certain segment of that population, that we are supposed to not be judgmental of misuse the items they can acquire.

 

Then they place the responsibility for doing background checks in the hands of those very people (The authorities) they have been skeptical about for as long as I can remember. In the Florida case, they were correct, because of sheer cowardliness, but did they even take a look at the police? No. they went directly after the gins and then the perp, in that order.

 

What it sounds like to me is irresponsible people who want others to clean up the mess they made, so if something does go wrong, in the meanwhile they can blame others instead of taking the responsibility for the absence of morality that's lead our society down the path of abject hedonism and ti value the individual above all else. They've cheapened the value of human life to a matter of convenience.

 

The idea of personal sacrifice is a punchline in a joke to them, which is why they are so dumbfounded at people who volunteer to take a bullet for another. Look at how they see the military. Look at how they see the police. enough said.

 

I look so much for the end times to get here and the rapture to take us away from all this wickedness and bring us into God's bosom. This place makes my heart ache

Just as misery loves company, so does immorality. Libs claim to be the tolerant ( Though they aren't towards true Christian religion. ) and accept deviant Godless, unrighteous behaviors and lifestyles readily because it seems to reflect their own lifestyles closer. Here again, not bashing libs. I have friends who aren't bad and lean left. I'm always reminded of the meaning of suffer, longsuffering. It is to allow. We are to be tolerant, forbearing, patient. Scripture says, "You suffer fools gladly." Not sure who Paul was speaking to there, because while I can be patient, I certainly take no joy in idiots.

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Hey reformed baptist,

 

Truth be told I have no problem with some more gun regulation. Here in Hawaii we have, as far back as I can remember, we have had background checks, needed permits and have had to register weapons. If you're straight it isn't a problem. I don't want certified crazies or ex cons easily acquiring them any more than any reasonable person, though it doesn't seem to be to difficult. What I don't want is a government diminishing the rights of law abiding cits simply because popular opinion swings one way or another. This is not a true democracy. The founders did not intend this nation to be run by popular vote. They considered the populace to fickle and uninformed.

 

We send them to Washington to make choices for us that as a group they consider to be in the best interest of the nation. California with their propositions puts some items out to popular vote, but that is minimal. Now it seems they they are swayed to easily by media and whoever yells the loudest. Unfortunately the young and those more readily influenced by slogans and emotional appeals seem to yell the loudest. We don't see conservatives hollering in the streets, protesting for the right to do wrong. They're busy working, spending time with loved ones and as a rule, I believe would just like to live their lives with those they love and be left alone.

 

Look up the word infringed, as in, shall not be. Then read the second amendment.

We may be closer than you think on gun laws. I believe the second amendment was put there to protect against the tyranny of government. I tend to think the people in Washington like it there and will do whatever it takes to stay there. I think they represent themselves first and when necessary toss a bone to the nosiest dog. Anyway....................

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Following are the New York State gun laws.

From the NRA website, Here; https://www.nraila.org/gun-laws/stat...laws/new-york/ [TABLE=class: gun_laws_overview]

[TR]

[/TR]

[TR]

[TD=class: title]Permit to Purchase[/TD]

[TD]No*[/TD]

[TD]Yes[/TD]

[/TR]

[TR]

[TD=class: title]Registration of Firearms[/TD]

[TD]No*[/TD]

[TD]Yes[/TD]

[/TR]

[TR]

[TD=class: title]Licensing of Owners[/TD]

[TD]No*[/TD]

[TD]Yes[/TD]

[/TR]

[TR]

[TD=class: title]Permit to Carry[/TD]

[TD]No*[/TD]

[TD]Yes[/TD]

[/TR]

[TR]

[TD=class: caveats, colspan: 3]* Except in New York City.[/TD]

[/TR]

[/TABLE]

 

England has some of the most stringent gun laws in the world.

Here is the murder rate for February in London. Taken from the Evening Standard, https://www.standard.co.uk/news/crim...-a3803566.html

 

"London's murder rate has overtaken New York City's for the first time ever, according to a new report.

 

February marked the first month the UK capital saw more murders than New York, with 15 dead (nine aged 30 or younger).

 

According to the report in the Sunday Times, London also suffered 22 fatal stabbings and shootings in March, higher than the 21 in the Big Apple".

 

While it may be more convenient to kill with a gun, it doesn't seem to diminish the desire to do so.

 

well, that's one way to misuse statistics

I'm clueless as to why they are misused. Please enlighten me.

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Following are the New York State gun laws.

From the NRA website, Here; https://www.nraila.org/gun-laws/stat...laws/new-york/ [TABLE=class: gun_laws_overview]

[TR]

[/TR]

[TR]

[TD=class: title]Permit to Purchase[/TD]

[TD]No*[/TD]

[TD]Yes[/TD]

[/TR]

[TR]

[TD=class: title]Registration of Firearms[/TD]

[TD]No*[/TD]

[TD]Yes[/TD]

[/TR]

[TR]

[TD=class: title]Licensing of Owners[/TD]

[TD]No*[/TD]

[TD]Yes[/TD]

[/TR]

[TR]

[TD=class: title]Permit to Carry[/TD]

[TD]No*[/TD]

[TD]Yes[/TD]

[/TR]

[TR]

[TD=class: caveats, colspan: 3]* Except in New York City.[/TD]

[/TR]

[/TABLE]

 

England has some of the most stringent gun laws in the world.

Here is the murder rate for February in London. Taken from the Evening Standard, https://www.standard.co.uk/news/crim...-a3803566.html

 

"London's murder rate has overtaken New York City's for the first time ever, according to a new report.

 

February marked the first month the UK capital saw more murders than New York, with 15 dead (nine aged 30 or younger).

 

According to the report in the Sunday Times, London also suffered 22 fatal stabbings and shootings in March, higher than the 21 in the Big Apple".

 

While it may be more convenient to kill with a gun, it doesn't seem to diminish the desire to do so.

 

well, that's one way to misuse statistics

For a start these are stats about gun and knife crime, being used to justify an argument regarding gun control - the inclusions of knife crime in the stats makes it an invalid comparison.

 

Secondly the period of comparison is very short (1-2 months) - what would the comparison be over the last ten years?

 

Thirdly it fails to take into account special circumstances - why has there been a recent increase in London gun crime and will that be sustained?

 

Fourthly it compares the worst situation in the UK with one of the better in USA (and in deliberately duplicitous way in my opinion, as it be obvious if it was being compared to a place like Austin) - why not compare it to New Orleans (62.1 gun related murders per 100,000 people) or Detroit (35.9 gun related murders per 100,000).

 

So - misuse of statistics in my book!

 

But as I say, I am not passing an opinion on the actual gun control/ right to bear arms that isn't my place.

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No one has said why the OP is a misuse of statistics. NYC was long THE place to go if you wanted to get murdered. How it happens doesn't change the fact that you're dead.

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No one has said why the OP is a misuse of statistics. NYC was long THE place to go if you wanted to get murdered. How it happens doesn't change the fact that you're dead.

I did - see comment #8.4 :D

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No Sir, that does not count. The populations are of similar size, the time period is specified, and murder is murder.

 

This is a statistical comparison, and it is presented as being an anomaly.

 

If it were being used as a basis for some longrange prediction, THEN it would be a misuse of statistics. As it is? It's merely presented as a surprising comparison. And NYC is THE most densely populated area in the US, so whatever your trying to complain about the basis of comparison there makes no sense. It has a long and sordid history of being riddled with crime.

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No Sir, that does not count. The populations are of similar size, the time period is specified, and murder is murder.

 

This is a statistical comparison, and it is presented as being an anomaly.

 

If it were being used as a basis for some longrange prediction, THEN it would be a misuse of statistics. As it is? It's merely presented as a surprising comparison. And NYC is THE most densely populated area in the US, so whatever your trying to complain about the basis of comparison there makes no sense. It has a long and sordid history of being riddled with crime.

It is presented a justification for not passing more stringent gun laws - so the simple fact that the London stats include knife crime as well is enough invalidate on it's own. For any comparison to be meaningful it needs to be like for like - so a comparison between Gun Crime in london and Gun Crime in NYC would be like for like - but even then such a comparison would have to come with certain caveats.

 

The populations are of similar size, the time period is specified, and murder is murder.

 

But are they of similar ethic diversity, population density etc

 

And NYC is THE most densely populated area in the US, so whatever your trying to complain about the basis of comparison there makes no sense. It has a long and sordid history of being riddled with crime.

 

Yet it is not the worst place in the US by a long, long way!

 

My complaints make perfect sense in regards to the stats - however that is all I am complaining about the misuse of the statistics to make a point - As I said above I am in no place to comment of what (if any) response your government should make regarding gun laws in the wake of recent tragedies - my opinion is uniformed and therefore worthless in such a discussion.

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London's murder rate including knife crime can't be compared to NYCs murder rate why? Murder is murder, and the victims are all dead.

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London's murder rate including knife crime can't be compared to NYCs murder rate why? Murder is murder, and the victims are all dead.

Take out the knife crime figures and it becomes relevant to an discussion on gun control - leave in the figures for knife crime and the data has no relevance to the subject matter at hand!

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It's amazing how people look at weapons as the problem. Maybe they should put all citizens in a padded room? What's next removing belts and all strings etc?

 

Sorry people, but this is a moral issue which pertains to how people view the sanctity of life.

 

I guess they'll no longer be able to "knight thee" by the sword! They'll probably end up using a rainbow colored feather duster :RpS_lol:

 

God bless,

William

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It's amazing how people look at weapons as the problem. Maybe they should put all citizens in a padded room? What's next removing belts and all strings etc?

 

Sorry people, but this is a moral issue which pertains to how people view the sanctity of life.

 

I guess they'll no longer be able to "knight thee" by the sword! They'll probably end up using a rainbow colored feather duster :RpS_lol:

 

God bless,

William

 

amen - excellent point - it's about the sanctity of life

 

guns for self defense are needed because most people are unprotected due to rural living - terrorism - crime/gangs

 

interesting the pro-choice agenda kills babies - and the pro-gun agenda allows you to protect your wife and babies

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