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Knotical

What will it look like?

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This month (July 2016) there will be at least two national conventions. One for the Democrats and one for the Republicans (no idea if the Libertarians will have one or not). We already are aware who the presumptive nominees for each party are, but what we don't know is who they will be choosing as their running mates. Trump is currently meeting with possible candidates, and Clinton seems to have already picked hers (Elizabeth Warren) without actually having announced (which is pretty much on par for her campaign, btw). Of course Gary Johnson has already picked his (can't remember who, and too lazy to look it up).

 

Who do you think Trump may pick and will it make any difference when he does? I have thought he would pick Chris Christie as Trump could use a good lapdog, but he may be smarter than that, and pick someone useful.

 

Thoughts?

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Trump and Christie would just be a terrible duo in my opinion. I think that you would want to pick someone who is strong where you are weak, and these two just seem to be the same person just with different circumstances. They both want the attention and the limelight and they are boastful, which I just do not find attractive for a Presidential candidate. It will interesting to watch and see where this thing goes, but I really not expecting anything too much in terms of intellectual debates, which is sad.

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Trump and Christie would just be a terrible duo in my opinion. I think that you would want to pick someone who is strong where you are weak, and these two just seem to be the same person just with different circumstances. They both want the attention and the limelight and they are boastful, which I just do not find attractive for a Presidential candidate. It will interesting to watch and see where this thing goes, but I really not expecting anything too much in terms of intellectual debates, which is sad.

 

Oh, that is a given. I don't expect much of an intellectual debate either; more of a mud fight, but without the mud.

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There some political analysts who think that Trump's statement, "Ted Cruz agrees with me 100%" is an indication that he'll be naming Cruz as his running mate but I doubt he'll be picking someone the establishment doesn't like. If he'll be choosing someone who was already in the presidential race then Kasich would be the one person he'd want to be his VP.

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There some political analysts who think that Trump's statement, "Ted Cruz agrees with me 100%" is an indication that he'll be naming Cruz as his running mate but I doubt he'll be picking someone the establishment doesn't like. If he'll be choosing someone who was already in the presidential race then Kasich would be the one person he'd want to be his VP.

 

Trump does like to go against the grain, at least as far as his campaign has evidenced. It is possible he is just using this as a tactic to get elected, then will just become another establishment president once in office. That is the concern I have about even considering voting for him.

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Trump does like to go against the grain, at least as far as his campaign has evidenced. It is possible he is just using this as a tactic to get elected, then will just become another establishment president once in office. That is the concern I have about even considering voting for him.

 

Those are my sentiments too. It was the reservation I had about Ben Carson with regard to a lack of voting record or political career. I really am lost as to how Trump portrayed Ted Cruz as a political insider..... nicknaming him further as Lying Ted. Ted Cruz based on his voting record, and political career is a thoroughbred Conservative Racehorse. But despite actual evidence people want to believe in the promises made by a man without a record. My conclusion from all this, the majority of Republicans don't want a "Constitutional" Republican.

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I can't imagine Trump surrounding himself with yes-men or drama queens/kings. I also can't imagine him using the useless in any of his activities over the years. Trump keeps that fortune of his by making brilliant decisions, and that includes knowing exactly who to hire for what job. People who don't know what they're doing never last long with Trump, so I imagine that he's making this very important selection with the utmost care. He's definitely not allowing the press to pin him down to any particular person, and that is a sound decision right there because he needs time to figure out for himself who is the best running mate. I think that unless we all suddenly jump into the Donald's head, and know exactly what he's thinking, we have no choice but to take him at his word... as we would have to do with any candidate. Just keep in mind that every vote not for Trump is automatically a win for Hillary, and I personally am not prepared for that to happen again. I'm being a bit facetious here but didn't we suffer through about 20 years of her and Bill already? :eek:;)

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Trump keeps that fortune of his by making brilliant decisions, and that includes knowing exactly who to hire for what job.

 

Like not giving to charity? http://newsexaminer.net/politics/don...e-billionaire/

 

Donald Trump has only donated $3.7 million to his own foundation. He ranks among the least charitable billionaires in the world. During the past two decades, the Trump foundation has made charitable contributions totaling a paltry $6.7 million. This guy is "more stingy" than Obama.

Just keep in mind that every vote not for Trump is automatically a win for Hillary, and I personally am not prepared for that to happen again.

I found nowhere in Scripture to suggest that we should elect a non God fearing man in order that our own political party should win.

 

God bless,

William

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I am struggling to process your reasoning about not voting for Donald Trump, William. If Hillary is elected, we certainly have NOT elected someone who is god-fearing by any stretch of the imagination, at least in my personal opinion.

It seems to me that a person should be voting for whichever candidate looks like they will do the best job of helping America get back up and working again.

God has used all kinds of people to accomplish his goals, and if Trump is not a Christian, that does not stop the possibility that he can do the job that God wants done.

 

As for who Trump will choose for a running mate, I think that he is keeping that for part of his bargaining process. He is not liked by the establishment Republicans, and if he wants their support in his campaign, he is going to have to make some compromises.

I think they will push him to choose someone who fits in with their plans and is much more controllable than Donald Trump is. Then there is also the rumors floating around the internet that the shadow government plans to have him put out of commission, maybe permanently.

In that case, they certainly want someone that they can manage to take over as President.

 

There remains yet another outcome, and that is that both candidates do not receive a majority of the votes, and the House has to choose the president, and the Senate then chooses the vice-president.

In that case, they could nominate someone totally different. Check this out to see how it might happen:

 

https://olddominionlibertarian.wordp...ton-and-trump/

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Donald Trump already told us that he was looking for a politician with a lot of sway with Congress so that his VP can help him get things done. I'm not exactly sure who that is going to be but I doubt it will be Lying Ted Cruz. No one likes him and Trump doesn't respect anyone he can play around with. He needs someone who is as politically savvy as he is business savvy. As for his lack of funds in charity, he probably considers it better to give people jobs than a handout. According to CNNMoney that at least thirty-four thousand jobs are directly attributed to Donald, that's not including the companies that he contracts out, and the work created by the deals he makes. Plus you have to take into the potential of the multiplier effect which could bring up that number to sixty-seven thousand jobs. And personally, given a choice, I would always chose a job over a hand out, there is more independence.

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I am struggling to process your reasoning about not voting for Donald Trump, William.

 

It is simple. Trump is not a believer, that lip service he gives may work on the left but I can't in good conscience vote for him. I will exercise the "other" option on the ballot.

 

I don't buy into the media narrative, people were saying Trump was our only chance before the primaries. I didn't believe it then, and I don't believe it now, and it just so happens that polling is reporting that he's now trailing behind Hilary by double digits.

 

William

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It is simple. Trump is not a believer, that lip service he gives may work on the left but I can't in good conscience vote for him. I will exercise the "other" option on the ballot.

 

I don't buy into the media narrative, people were saying Trump was our only chance before the primaries. I didn't believe it then, and I don't believe it now, and it just so happens that polling is reporting that he's now trailing behind Hilary by double digits.

 

William

 

I don't support Trump, and I have understood much of the sentiment of what you have said in this discussion. But this is where I think you go to far. To my knowledge Trump hasn't come out and stated if he was a believer or not. You don't know what he believes, and probably should not be passing judgement in that area.

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I guess Donald Trump will win the elections, eventually. He's got all the chances. He's a natural born advertiser and entrepreneur, so he knows how to promote his policy to make it work. Even though he might be a Christian officially, he doesn't seem to be very religious.

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I don't support Trump, and I have understood much of the sentiment of what you have said in this discussion. But this is where I think you go to far. To my knowledge Trump hasn't come out and stated if he was a believer or not. You don't know what he believes, and probably should not be passing judgement in that area.

 

 

Is that what you believe, and that is your judgment?

  • Exodus 18:21 Moreover, look for able men from all the people, men who fear God, who are trustworthy and hate a bribe, and place such men over the people as chiefs of thousands, of hundreds, of fifties, and of tens.

Lemme go further, Trump states he is a believer. Trump says he has never asked God for forgiveness. Think about that. Trump brags about having politicians in his back pocket (making a bribe) and Trump also says he is a member of a church, the Pastor of that church said Trump is not a member. Obviously the post I gave shows he gives very little to charity. The man mockingly nicknames, lies and promises to be vindictive towards others that do not agree with him should he get into office. Tell me what true believer you know that has such an unbridled tongue? Trump for the longest time dodged answering a simple question, like which is his favorite Bible verse, and after cornered in an interview he finally answered saying, an eye for an eye and a tooth for a tooth...

 

Mind you, I am not even going into his actual record which supports the abortion factory Planned Parenthood. ...

 

You are more than welcome to believe what he says, but I'd rather go by his fruits. If all was about money then I'd be inclined to get on the money train, but it isn't. For a no holds blunt response, I think Trump has tapped into a demographic of undesirable Americans. Trump will not limit himself, like Obama, by the Constitution. I'm not voting for a king, queen, or dictator, and surely not the lighter shade of a morally bankrupt version of Obama. The man has played lip tribute to our soldiers, a man that says he never read or saw the value in the U.S. Constitution, mind you the Constitution, which he himself will take an oath like our soldiers to uphold and defend from both foreign and domestic threats, the very same Constitution so many have died defending.

 

Personally, I keep hearing that Trump is the lesser of two evils. I ask that you or anyone else first acknowledge that the lesser evil is still evil, and not to expect a Christian to vote evil in the election. We are given the option to exercise "other" on the ballot, and it will fulfill our personal duty as Christians.

 

William

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There are good reasons to separate religion from politics. Some of that has just been illustrated clearly to me in this topic. I intend to vote my conscience, not the lesser of two evils, but it is not my place to judge my fellow man for how they vote or to judge the nature of Trump's relationship with God. Those are for God to judge.

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There are good reasons to separate religion from politics.

 

Care to share them? And do you believe there should be a Christian or an Evangelical vote?

 

I'd also like to know how you understand separation of church and state, and whether you think a Christian should vote, and if a Christian does vote whether he should not base his vote on Scripture? Lastly, do you think there is a place in politics for a Christian? Or must one put aside his Christian faith while in politics?

 

I intend to vote my conscience, not the lesser of two evils, but it is not my place to judge my fellow man for how they vote or to judge the nature of Trump's relationship with God. Those are for God to judge.

 

Exactly how is your conscience guided? In case you missed it I quoted Exodus 18:21 Moreover, look for able men from all the people, men who fear God, who are trustworthy and hate a bribe, and place such men over the people as chiefs of thousands, of hundreds, of fifties, and of tens.

 

Will you use that to guide your conscience, and if so how will you look for able men, men who fear God, and who are trustworthy..... if you do not make moral judgments?

 

William

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I keep hearing that Trump is the lesser of two evils.

I've heard that a lot and I am beginning to wonder if he is the lesser evil.

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Prior to beginning his campaign I had thought Trump would make a good president because he is a businessman. I have thought for a long time we needed a businessman in the white house who knew how to make an organization profitable and it is possible Trump would be that guy. However, once he did start his campaign and I saw the kind of personality with which he was thrusting his ideas upon people I was very turned off. His arrogance was not something that sat well with me. I have never considered him a Christian, but of course that is completely between him and God; however, his fruit does not scream Christian to me.

 

At the end of the day it has to come down to their proposed policies and our reasonable expectation as to whether or not the candidate we choose will make good on the promises they make.

 

Personally, I will be shocked if Hillary gets in the White House, although if she does I expect to see quite a bit of backlash, especially with the increasing number of controversies that are surrounding her. It really is up to us voters now to make sure she does not become president since our government has done very little, if anything to facilitate any consequences for her many transgressions.

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It is good to hear your views Knotical. I just don't get how Americans can honestly assess Trump as being no political insider. When I think of a political insider I think of lots of money being thrown around. What appeals to most Americans about Trump? Take his money away and what do we have, has he then lost his sway?

 

Personally, I will be shocked if Hillary gets in the White House

 

I don't really think anything could surprise me at this point. But I have to admit that after listening to others namely about their views of whether "religion" belongs in politics, I'm starting to lean theonomy.

 

God bless,

William

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It is good to hear your views Knotical. I just don't get how Americans can honestly assess Trump as being no political insider. When I think of a political insider I think of lots of money being thrown around. What appeals to most Americans about Trump? Take his money away and what do we have, has he then lost his sway?

 

 

 

I don't really think anything could surprise me at this point. But I have to admit that after listening to others namely about their views of whether "religion" belongs in politics, I'm starting to lean theonomy.

 

God bless,

William

 

Oh, I would be in complete support of a Theocracy, if humans weren't involved. I know that is not what you are referring to, but if we were to model our government after Heaven then a Theocracy it is. Which is basically communism with God in charge. I have held that communism is the most perfect form of government, on paper. The problem with any system we could possibly put in place to run a country is always going to have the flaw that it is run by humans. Unfortunately, our country really has the best government available to us that can be run by humans.

 

Trump may or may not be a political insider, but the biggest difference between him and any of the politicians from which we have to choose is that he knows how to make money, and in the process employ a workforce. Whereas those like Hillary are only generating money without helping anyone else but themselves.

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Oh, I would be in complete support of a Theocracy, if humans weren't involved. I know that is not what you are referring to, but if we were to model our government after Heaven then a Theocracy it is. Which is basically communism with God in charge. I have held that communism is the most perfect form of government, on paper. The problem with any system we could possibly put in place to run a country is always going to have the flaw that it is run by humans. Unfortunately, our country really has the best government available to us that can be run by humans.

 

Trump may or may not be a political insider, but the biggest difference between him and any of the politicians from which we have to choose is that he knows how to make money, and in the process employ a workforce. Whereas those like Hillary are only generating money without helping anyone else but themselves.

 

Communism is better on paper. I couldn't agree more with you. However, I'm just pointing out that I don't believe the narrative that Hillary is one of us poor folk. She's a billionaire too, and I question whether Trump's ideologies are better for the country, I am wary of those sooth sayers trying to tickle my ears .....

 

Last night I came across an interesting article. Just like to share it: http://www.cnn.com/2016/07/06/politics/donald-trump-favorite-dictators-and-strongmen/

 

God bless,

William

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Communism is better on paper. I couldn't agree more with you. However, I'm just pointing out that I don't believe the narrative that Hillary is one of us poor folk. She's a billionaire too, and I question whether Trump's ideologies are better for the country, I am wary of those sooth sayers trying to tickle my ears .....

 

Last night I came across an interesting article. Just like to share it: http://www.cnn.com/2016/07/06/politics/donald-trump-favorite-dictators-and-strongmen/

 

God bless,

William

 

If that article had been coming from a truly independent news source I might have given it some credibility, but CNN? I wouldn't trust them as far as I could throw MSNBC. Too much bias involved to take them seriously.

 

As for Trump admiring dictators, I would first really look into how he ran his companies. Must companies are really run that way, and may, to a varying degree, be subject to the direction of a board of directors. But Trump, to me, has really probably run his businesses as a benevolent dictator, if anything.

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If that article had been coming from a truly independent news source I might have given it some credibility, but CNN? I wouldn't trust them as far as I could throw MSNBC. Too much bias involved to take them seriously.

 

As for Trump admiring dictators, I would first really look into how he ran his companies. Must companies are really run that way, and may, to a varying degree, be subject to the direction of a board of directors. But Trump, to me, has really probably run his businesses as a benevolent dictator, if anything.

 

Right, you have reiterated my reservations about sharing anything from CNN.

 

But Trump, to me, has really probably run his businesses as a benevolent dictator, if anything.

 

I see no reason to believe the man would limit himself in respect of the Constitution or cares about the purity of our forefather's ideology. If anyone believes otherwise, I welcome you to open my eyes to this fact. Whether or not Trump would be benevolent just makes me wonder whether he would be the beginning of a long line of "dictators". We have lost our Constitutional Republic for a democracy, someone correct me if wrong, but the whole point of having a Constitution was to protect us from the majority vote in a democracy, by preserving certain unalienable rights .... . ?

 

God bless,

William

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He would not be the beginning. We can thank Barry for that.

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It probably is a lot more difficult than it seems. I would also assume that in theory it might be perfectly easy, but just considering the case of the United States, there are so many cultural and societal factors at work that it would be overwhelming to even try to name them all. It is an interesting question to pose though, what it would look like, but I honestly can say I have no idea and would really need some time to think about it. I am curious to hear of real life examples, or efforts, if there are any.

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