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Disagreements in Christian Life

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    Disagreements in Christian Life

    If you bite and devour each other, watch out or you will be destroyed by each other. - Galatians 5:15

    It is unbelievable at times to see how even believers can disagree. One side sticks their feet in and the other side does also. No one is budging or willing to say they are wrong, both are right! Or so they think. Disagreements also happen in marriages, Churches and ministries.

    The world is helplessly divided as people have strong opinions on so many different topics and choices in life. These strong beliefs people have even come to the place where hurtful actions are taken against each other because of our desires to be right and have our own way (James 4:1).

    Many people are divided and hurt over differences in the body of Christ also as the Apostle James wrote to believers who were "warring" against each other. All these differences result in hurt lives, divided believers and the world looking on in shock and amazement at this scene. When we can claim to believe in the greatest news in the world that men can be freed from their sins and point to this life-giving Saviour but in the same breath speak evil of our other brethren that have been redeemed we bring a reproach to the world.

    The beautiful opposite of disagreements is agreement and unity. Our Lord says: That all of them may be one, Father, just as you are in me and I am in you. May they also be in us so that the world may believe that you have sent me. (John 17:21). St. Clement of Rome in AD 90 said, "“Love admits no schisms: love gives rise to no seditions: love does all things in harmony.”

    Christ is not divided neither is his body should be divided. When we humble ourselves and pick up our crosses we choose the low way below disagreements. It takes 2 brothers to argue and debate, but a humble brother will not answer back. Choose today to be an agent of peace and humility, this is pleasing to the Lord and allows His body to be beautiful to Him and the on looking world.

    #2
    Hi Greg

    Nice post, I just wanted to say, I learn more when I disagree with someone. It forces me to dive deeper into the scriptures then when we agree.
    A disagreement does not mean, I am speaking out of love, if I come across that way I apologize and would love to be made aware of those times





    Comment>

      #3
      Originally posted by greggordon View Post
      If you bite and devour each other, watch out or you will be destroyed by each other. - Galatians 5:15

      It is unbelievable at times to see how even believers can disagree. One side sticks their feet in and the other side does also. No one is budging or willing to say they are wrong, both are right! Or so they think. Disagreements also happen in marriages, Churches and ministries.

      The world is helplessly divided as people have strong opinions on so many different topics and choices in life. These strong beliefs people have even come to the place where hurtful actions are taken against each other because of our desires to be right and have our own way (James 4:1).

      Many people are divided and hurt over differences in the body of Christ also as the Apostle James wrote to believers who were "warring" against each other. All these differences result in hurt lives, divided believers and the world looking on in shock and amazement at this scene. When we can claim to believe in the greatest news in the world that men can be freed from their sins and point to this life-giving Saviour but in the same breath speak evil of our other brethren that have been redeemed we bring a reproach to the world.

      The beautiful opposite of disagreements is agreement and unity. Our Lord says: That all of them may be one, Father, just as you are in me and I am in you. May they also be in us so that the world may believe that you have sent me. (John 17:21). St. Clement of Rome in AD 90 said, "“Love admits no schisms: love gives rise to no seditions: love does all things in harmony.”

      Christ is not divided neither is his body should be divided. When we humble ourselves and pick up our crosses we choose the low way below disagreements. It takes 2 brothers to argue and debate, but a humble brother will not answer back. Choose today to be an agent of peace and humility, this is pleasing to the Lord and allows His body to be beautiful to Him and the on looking world.
      Thank You !!! To God be the Glory, not the gory............
      Comment>

        #4
        Originally posted by Guppy View Post
        Hi Greg

        Nice post, I just wanted to say, I learn more when I disagree with someone. It forces me to dive deeper into the scriptures then when we agree.
        A disagreement does not mean, I am speaking out of love, if I come across that way I apologize and would love to be made aware of those times




        You're right -- we learn more -- need to dig into Scripture more when we're challenged. And, sometimes we Do 'agree to disagree'.
        Comment>

          #5
          In essentials Unity. In non-essentials Liberty. In all things Charity. ... and may God grant us the wisdom to know the difference!

          However, there are things that I am unwilling to sacrifice Truth on the altar of Unity over. The absolute DEITY of Jesus heading up that list. Jesus is NOT the greatest of God's creations and those who claim so are NOT 'brothers and sisters' of mine. To pretend otherwise is to damn them with false hope in a false gospel.

          Proverbs 27:6 NASB Faithful are the wounds of a friend, but deceitful are the kisses of an enemy.
          Comment>

            #6
            Originally posted by atpollard View Post
            In essentials Unity. In non-essentials Liberty. In all things Charity. ... and may God grant us the wisdom to know the difference!

            However, there are things that I am unwilling to sacrifice Truth on the altar of Unity over. The absolute DEITY of Jesus heading up that list. Jesus is NOT the greatest of God's creations and those who claim so are NOT 'brothers and sisters' of mine. To pretend otherwise is to damn them with false hope in a false gospel.

            Proverbs 27:6 NASB Faithful are the wounds of a friend, but deceitful are the kisses of an enemy.
            I will appreciate it if you can clarify your post. Thanks!
            Comment>

              #7
              It is incomprehensible that the Body of Christ can and will engage in debate.
              Comment>

                #8
                Originally posted by Winken View Post
                I will appreciate it if you can clarify your post. Thanks!
                I'll give it a shot.

                My pastor was raised Moravian, and I stumbled across the motto of the Moravian church: "In essentials Unity. In non-essentials Liberty. In all things Charity."
                Breaking that down ...

                "In essentials Unity" means that there are certain truths that all Christians should hold and should be united in if we are to call ourselves Christians. Jesus really lived, was really crucified and really rose from the dead. There are people who "call" themselves Christian that believe that the Bible is completely allegorical and there is no connection between and historic Jesus and what is written about him in the Bible. I could not stand in Christian unity with someone who does not believe that Jesus really existed. In my opinion, they are not a Christian and not part of the Body of Christ.

                "In non-essentials Liberty" means that there are things that I believe are true and am willing to defend my beliefs from scripture if asked or if challenged in the Church or the public marketplace of opinion. However, these issues do not determine ones salvation or membership in the Body of Christ. I can disagree with a Brother or Sister in Christ on these issues and still be friends ... still viewing them as a brother or sister in Christ. A classic example is the epic debates that I have had with William over whether one should drown babies or wait until they are old enough to swim to be properly baptized. [I am making a bit of a joke]. However, we have debated Acts and the place of a New Covenant Church comprised of "families" or a New Covenant Church comprised of "called individuals". There is Scripture to support both views and scripture that challenges each view. So we passionately discuss this point of difference and each allows the other the "Liberty" to believe differently in this "non-essential" (as in not essential for salvation).

                Which is the point of the third part, "In all things Charity", which simply means that essential or non-essential ... brother/sister or sinner ... whatever we do and whomever we interact with, all things are to be done in love. Even if you believe that God hates abortion, screaming "baby-killer" at women entering and leaving an abortion clinic, or throwing blood on the homes of nurses who work there are NOT acts of love. They are not done in a spirit of 'charity'.

                To the Moravian Motto, I added the tag from the 'serenity prayer' [God grant us the serenity to accept the things we can not change, courage to change the things we can, and the wisdom to know the difference."]
                "... and may God grant us the wisdom to know the difference!" seemed particularly appropriate to the internet where I encounter a lot of people who want to turn non-essentials into Holy Wars. I can only speak for me, but someone like a Jehovah's Witness who denies the deity of Christ or a Mormon with a theology of many gods and we, too will become gods, have not placed their trust in Jesus as the ONLY Way, Truth and Light. Such a person cannot be saved (at present with their current beliefs) and are NOT a brother or sister in Christ. It seems wrong to pretend that they are a 'brother/sister' and not to tell them the truth if asked or the opportunity presents itself. This was the meaning behind my statement:
                Originally posted by atpollard View Post
                However, there are things that I am unwilling to sacrifice Truth on the altar of Unity over. The absolute DEITY of Jesus heading up that list. Jesus is NOT the greatest of God's creations and those who claim so are NOT 'brothers and sisters' of mine. To pretend otherwise is to damn them with false hope in a false gospel.
                The final verse ...

                Proverbs 27:6 NASB Faithful are the wounds of a friend, but deceitful are the kisses of an enemy.

                ... points to my personal philosophy on the matter. To pretend something is true that you know to be false is not an act of kindness. It is an act or cowardice. If the matter is essential to salvation, then you are an accomplice in their damnation. How can you allow a person to march to their death in blissful ignorance when YOU knew the truth and refused to speak. Is that "kiss" not the kiss of an enemy?

                On the other hand, if someone is wrong and you attempt to correct their false belief by pointing them to the truth found in scripture, is that short term "wound" not, ultimately, the faithful blessings of a friend?


                I hope that explains my post better.

                Comment>

                  #9
                  @atpollard............. I sincerely and respectfully thank you for your response. One question remains

                  You wrote:

                  "Jesus is NOT the greatest of God's creations and those who claim so are NOT 'brothers and sisters' of mine."

                  Could you clarify that, please? Thanks!
                  Comment>

                    #10
                    Originally posted by Winken View Post
                    @atpollard............. I sincerely and respectfully thank you for your response. One question remains
                    You wrote:
                    "Jesus is NOT the greatest of God's creations and those who claim so are NOT 'brothers and sisters' of mine."
                    Could you clarify that, please? Thanks!
                    Jehovah's Witness (among others) believe that God is God the Father and Jesus is something less than God that was created by God. The details differ from group to group, but they have two things in common.
                    1. Jesus is not God (often he is like a super-angel).
                    2. They still claim to be Christians (which I cannot accept as a fact)
                    I attended a church where they changed pastors and the new pastor began teaching less and less from the Bible and more and more from popular movies like The Matrix. I eventually learned that he viewed all of the Bible stories of Jesus as allegorical fables designed to teach us how to treat each other. Can one be a Christian who does not believe that Christ was a real person? Can one be a Christian who believes that Christ was just a man? Can one be a Christian who believes Christ is less than what the Gospel says Christ is?

                    If someone does not believe the true Gospel, but makes up their own and teaches the false gospel to others ... are they part of the Church? Can we embrace them as brothers and sisters in Christ, or do we have a duty to oppose them and their lies?

                    The truth about Christ is one of the few areas that I care about so deeply that I would break fellowship rather than compromise on the truth ...
                    We believe in one God the Father Almighty, Maker of heaven and earth, and of all things visible and invisible.

                    “And in one Lord Jesus Christ, the only-begotten Son of God, begotten of the Father before all worlds, God of God, Light of Light, Very God of Very God, begotten, not made, being of one substance with the Father by whom all things were made; who for us men, and for our salvation, came down from heaven, and was incarnate by the Holy Spirit of the Virgin Mary, and was made man, and was crucified also for us under Pontius Pilate. He suffered and was buried, and the third day he rose again according to the Scriptures, and ascended into heaven, and sitteth on the right hand of the Father. And he shall come again with glory to judge both the quick and the dead, whose kingdom shall have no end.

                    “And we believe in the Holy Spirit, the Lord and Giver of Life, who proceedeth from the Father, who with the Father and the Son together is worshipped and glorified, who spoke by the prophets. And we believe in one holy catholic and apostolic Church. We acknowledge one baptism for the remission of sins. And we look for the resurrection of the dead, and the life of the world to come. Amen."

                    This is a hill worth dying on.
                    Comment>

                      #11
                      Originally posted by atpollard View Post
                      Jehovah's Witness (among others) believe that God is God the Father and Jesus is something less than God that was created by God. The details differ from group to group, but they

                      OK. Thanks again!

                      Comment>

                        #12
                        Originally posted by atpollard View Post
                        1. Jesus is not God (often he is like a super-angel).
                        atpollard,

                        I met a man quite some time ago who affirmed the Lord Jesus is God. However, he was quite insistent that the Lord Jesus was not God while He was on the earth (from conception to His death).

                        - I suppose He "regained His Goodhood" via His resurrection (?)

                        I didn't at the time and I don't agree with him now.

                        Do you believe his belief/teaching is heresy?

                        Comment>

                          #13
                          Originally posted by Faber View Post

                          atpollard,

                          I met a man quite some time ago who affirmed the Lord Jesus is God. However, he was quite insistent that the Lord Jesus was not God while He was on the earth (from conception to His death).

                          - I suppose He "regained His Goodhood" via His resurrection (?)

                          I didn't at the time and I don't agree with him now.

                          Do you believe his belief/teaching is heresy?
                          Yes, it is heresy.

                          Comment>

                            #14
                            I believe that the Holy Spirit through the Word of God can bring unity. We are living in periled times right now. Jesus warned us of this in 2 Timothy 4:3-4 "For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine, but according to their own desires, because they have itching ears, they will heap up for themselves teachers; and they will turn their ears away from the truth, and be turned aside to fables." It's no surprise to me that there is a lot of division in the church. In 2 Thessalonians 2:15 says "Therefore brethren, stand fast and hold the traditions which you were taught, whether by word or our epistle." I believe that sometimes, Christians hold their opinion about the scripture above the scripture. I certainly have at times. Learning to discern that is very helpful. But, not all will be willing to lay their opinion down, and see if it lines up with scripture. Paul said not to philosophy with the philosophers about scripture. Colossians 2:1-10. The traditions of the Word of God is far above that of the traditions of the word of man.I believe when the church comes back to sound doctrine as laid out in scripture, then unity may begin. These are things that I have been doing a lot of thinking about in my own life. Sometimes, I like to share my thoughts in the midst of the process I'm in.
                            Comment>

                              #15
                              Originally posted by foundling View Post
                              These are things that I have been doing a lot of thinking about in my own life. Sometimes, I like to share my thoughts in the midst of the process I'm in.
                              Thanks for sharing this with us.

                              You also wrote: "I believe that sometimes, Christians hold their opinion about the scripture above the scripture."
                              What examples do you think would apply to this?

                              Thank you.

                              Comment>
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