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Christian Groups Warn New 'Conversion Therapy' Bill Could Suppress Free Speech

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The California Assembly approved a bill that would made “conversion therapy” subject to the state’s consumer protection laws.

 

 

 

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As the saying goes -- the proof is in the pudding. People who Have been homosexual and Have changed -- will be proof that 'conversion therapy' Does / Can work.

 

No law can change the Facts of what God / Holy Spirit can do in an individual's life.

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Some things are not to be tolerated.. 60-70 years ago Christians well meaning Christians stepped away from politics . Setting back waiting for rapture ..

 

We are to occupy...

 

Luk 19:12 He said therefore, A certain nobleman went into a far country to receive for himself a kingdom, and to return.

Luk 19:13 And he called his ten servants, and delivered them ten pounds, and said unto them, Occupy till I come.

Luk 19:14 But his citizens hated him, and sent a message after him, saying, We will not have this man to reign over us.

Luk 19:15 And it came to pass, that when he was returned, having received the kingdom, then he commanded these servants to be called unto him, to whom he had given the money, that he might know how much every man had gained by trading.

Luk 19:16 Then came the first, saying, Lord, thy pound hath gained ten pounds.

Luk 19:17 And he said unto him, Well, thou good servant: because thou hast been faithful in a very little, have thou authority over ten cities.

Luk 19:18 And the second came, saying, Lord, thy pound hath gained five pounds.

Luk 19:19 And he said likewise to him, Be thou also over five cities.

Luk 19:20 And another came, saying, Lord, behold, here is thy pound, which I have kept laid up in a napkin:

Luk 19:21 For I feared thee, because thou art an austere man: thou takest up that thou layedst not down, and reapest that thou didst not sow.

Luk 19:22 And he saith unto him, Out of thine own mouth will I judge thee, thou wicked servant. Thou knewest that I was an austere man, taking up that I laid not down, and reaping that I did not sow:

Luk 19:23 Wherefore then gavest not thou my money into the bank, that at my coming I might have required mine own with usury?

Luk 19:24 And he said unto them that stood by, Take from him the pound, and give it to him that hath ten pounds.

Luk 19:25 (And they said unto him, Lord, he hath ten pounds.)

Luk 19:26 For I say unto you, That unto every one which hath shall be given; and from him that hath not, even that he hath shall be taken away from him.

Luk 19:27 But those mine enemies, which would not that I should reign over them, bring hither, and slay them before me.

 

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As the saying goes -- the proof is in the pudding. People who Have been homosexual and Have changed -- will be proof that 'conversion therapy' Does / Can work.

 

No law can change the Facts of what God / Holy Spirit can do in an individual's life.

 

Hmm ... people choosing to not act on same sex attraction, whether they become celibate or act on their heterosexuality they had all along, is not the same thing as "conversion therapy."

 

God can certainly change people! But conversion therapy has used all sorts of unethical practices including deluging homosexuals with heterosexual pornography, having a female "counselor" try to seduce him, and other things we Christians would object to. The end justifies the means isn't a saying we should be using here. There really is a good reason to object to "conversion therapy," per se.

 

There is probably also good reason to object to this bill. We should always be free to speak against the evil of homosexual behavior.

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Conversion Therapy is barbaric and does not work.

It should be barred. Only God can change hearts to move from their sin. How can we ever think torture is of God?

 

It does a service to being fully informed of the facts to read the law for yourselves.

http://leginfo.legislature.ca.gov/faces/billTextClient.xhtml?bill_id=201720180AB2943

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Some things are not to be tolerated.. 60-70 years ago Christians well meaning Christians stepped away from politics . Setting back waiting for rapture ..

 

We are to occupy...

 

Luk 19:12 He said therefore, A certain nobleman went into a far country to receive for himself a kingdom, and to return.

Luk 19:13 And he called his ten servants, and delivered them ten pounds, and said unto them, Occupy till I come.

Luk 19:14 But his citizens hated him, and sent a message after him, saying, We will not have this man to reign over us.

Luk 19:15 And it came to pass, that when he was returned, having received the kingdom, then he commanded these servants to be called unto him, to whom he had given the money, that he might know how much every man had gained by trading.

Luk 19:16 Then came the first, saying, Lord, thy pound hath gained ten pounds.

Luk 19:17 And he said unto him, Well, thou good servant: because thou hast been faithful in a very little, have thou authority over ten cities.

Luk 19:18 And the second came, saying, Lord, thy pound hath gained five pounds.

Luk 19:19 And he said likewise to him, Be thou also over five cities.

Luk 19:20 And another came, saying, Lord, behold, here is thy pound, which I have kept laid up in a napkin:

Luk 19:21 For I feared thee, because thou art an austere man: thou takest up that thou layedst not down, and reapest that thou didst not sow.

Luk 19:22 And he saith unto him, Out of thine own mouth will I judge thee, thou wicked servant. Thou knewest that I was an austere man, taking up that I laid not down, and reaping that I did not sow:

Luk 19:23 Wherefore then gavest not thou my money into the bank, that at my coming I might have required mine own with usury?

Luk 19:24 And he said unto them that stood by, Take from him the pound, and give it to him that hath ten pounds.

Luk 19:25 (And they said unto him, Lord, he hath ten pounds.)

Luk 19:26 For I say unto you, That unto every one which hath shall be given; and from him that hath not, even that he hath shall be taken away from him.

Luk 19:27 But those mine enemies, which would not that I should reign over them, bring hither, and slay them before me.

 

yes - what a huge mistake that was

 

and now the whole country is paying for it

 

i guess they didn't understand what Jesus meant when He said occupy til I return - Luke 19:13

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Conversion Therapy is barbaric and does not work.

It should be barred. Only God can change hearts to move from their sin. How can we ever think torture is of God?

 

It does a service to being fully informed of the facts to read the law for yourselves.

http://leginfo.legislature.ca.gov/faces/billTextClient.xhtml?bill_id=201720180AB2943

 

what is conversion therapy?

 

i thought it was cognitive therapy to deal with thoughts and feelings

 

cognitive therapy is NOT as powerful as God's awesome healing of hearts and minds but cognitive therapy does affect people by showing them that thoughts and feelings can be changed

 

what parts do you feel are barbaric?

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what is conversion therapy?

 

i thought it was cognitive therapy to deal with thoughts and feelings

 

cognitive therapy is NOT as powerful as God's awesome healing of hearts and minds but cognitive therapy does affect people by showing them that thoughts and feelings can be changed

 

what parts do you feel are barbaric?

The American Psychiatric Association reported of its harm and fraudulence. How can a harmful treatment then be legal?

 

 

 

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The American Psychiatric Association reported of its harm and fraudulence. How can a harmful treatment then be legal?

 

 

 

 

what did they say was harmful?

 

the apa may be wrong about their assessment

 

they are the ones that presently say people are born with sexual proclivities - but God says it is not so - that He created us male and female

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That link gives no substance, and does leave the question of what's wrong with conversion therapy unanswered.

The problem with a bill like this is people who do want help will be less likely to find it.

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That link gives no substance, and does leave the question of what's wrong with conversion therapy unanswered.

The problem with a bill like this is people who do want help will be less likely to find it.

 

that's what i was wondering - without understanding what conversion therapy is it's hard to know what's up with this

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That link gives no substance, and does leave the question of what's wrong with conversion therapy unanswered.

The problem with a bill like this is people who do want help will be less likely to find it.

 

that's what i was wondering - without understanding what conversion therapy is it's hard to know what's up with this

I just Googled 'What is conversion therapy". There are many articles about it. None being favorable. Apparently the idea is to make a person hate themselves as being homosexual and then rebuild them 'in Jesus'. Apparently there is no licencing involved for the therapist. And apparently done with 15 - 16 yr olds.

 

Seems that Anything in the homosexual world that is religious in nature is bad. The idea being that homosexuals are born that way and need to be left alone. That anyone who wants to try to change them is being cruel, mean-spirited towards them.

 

Unfortunately Biblical morality is considered to be archaic. If the Bible / God's Word is not considered to be the authority figure -- it won't matter if some activity is an abomination to God.

 

It's Also true , though, that Bible study -- prayer -- concerned friends Can be a Positive influence. And it helps a Lot to understand the circumstances in the person's life.

 

Lots of teens get caught up in homosexuality when going through puberty. They need to be able to really talk and be listened to about how they feel. And guided Biblically. There's a need to learn how to be a simple Friend with others. To Not let the physical enter a relationship. To guard their hearts and bodies. And Not the concept that "if it feels good, go ahead and Do it".

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As the saying goes -- the proof is in the pudding. People who Have been homosexual and Have changed -- will be proof that 'conversion therapy' Does / Can work.

 

No law can change the Facts of what God / Holy Spirit can do in an individual's life.

 

Hmm ... people choosing to not act on same sex attraction, whether they become celibate or act on their heterosexuality they had all along, is not the same thing as "conversion therapy."

 

God can certainly change people! But conversion therapy has used all sorts of unethical practices including deluging homosexuals with heterosexual pornography, having a female "counselor" try to seduce him, and other things we Christians would object to. The end justifies the means isn't a saying we should be using here. There really is a good reason to object to "conversion therapy," per se.

 

There is probably also good reason to object to this bill. We should always be free to speak against the evil of homosexual behavior.

I just found out what 'conversion therapy' Is. I thought it meant spiritual conversion. Not true.

 

And -- you're right.

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That link gives no substance, and does leave the question of what's wrong with conversion therapy unanswered.

The problem with a bill like this is people who do want help will be less likely to find it.

 

that's what i was wondering - without understanding what conversion therapy is it's hard to know what's up with this

thanks for this info and the time you spent on getting it - also thanks for your comments on the whole issue - it was very helpful - God bless you

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Sue's talking about something we grew up with that was known as "guidance." That seems to be labelled an archaic value, too.

 

We need to turn this around!

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Sue's talking about something we grew up with that was known as "guidance." That seems to be labelled an archaic value, too.

 

We need to turn this around!

 

i know there is cognitive therapy that works - there is no tearing down - there is only cognitive work - and trigger defusing - and emotional and mental rephrasing and recontextualizing

 

there is nothing tortuous about it - it is a valuable method to identify thoughts and feelings - and then measure them against truth and better thoughts and feelings that produce a strength based on truth

 

for example - if a person thinks they are born this way there is no hope - but if they realize they were influenced this way they can look at the trigger/catalyst - and then defuse the trigger catatlyst

 

but it needs to be done with a properly trained therapist

 

or it can be done with God via His power and grace - God's truth sets us free if we come to the point where we believe Him over our feelings/thoughts

 

these 2 methods do work - i know of those who have used it effectively - and it matches scripture that says to take every thought captive to the truth - 2 Corinthians 10:5

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Imagine if someone tried to convert any heterosexual here to homosexuality using treatment methods.

Conversion therapy does not work. But to make the therapy centers a lot of money claiming it will.

 

 

 

This link gives more detail than the prior one.

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Imagine if someone tried to convert any heterosexual here to homosexuality using treatment methods.

Conversion therapy does not work. But to make the therapy centers a lot of money claiming it will.

 

 

 

This link gives more detail than the prior one.

 

page 11 of the 1st link says this:

Groups that promote conversion therapy often point to a single study to support their work. In 2003, famed psychiatrist Robert Spitzer, who spearheaded the removal of homosexuality from the American Psychiatric Association's mental disorder list in 1973, reported in the journal Archives of Sexual Behavior that interviews with conversion therapy patients suggested that some people could change their sexual orientation.

 

The paper was incendiary and highly criticized, given that it relied on interviews with patients instead of measurable benchmarks of same-sex desires. Conservative groups were delighted to have support from Spitzer, who wasn't tainted with religious bias or anti-gay ideology; gay organizations felt betrayed.

 

In the end, however, Spitzer came to agree with his critics. There was no way to confirm that what his interviewees said was true, he wrote in 2012 to the editor of the journal Archives of Sexual Behavior. The study, he said, was fatally flawed.

 

"I believe I owe the gay community an apology for my study making unproven claims of the efficacy of reparative therapy," Spitzer wrote.

 

i know people who have testified that they have converted and how they did it - yet this article says that they don't believe these people - because there were no measurable benchmarks of same sex desires

 

so the person with a true experience of sexual conversion/healing is ignored because a group with a theory doesn't know how to measure the level of desire?

 

that is the fallacy of these kinds of critics - they ignore proofs that disagree with their theory

 

the only valid thing i could see in the 11 pages of the 1st link is that some pretend therapists with no papers of accreditation conned the victim out of thousands of dollars for the pretend therapy

 

what does that prove? - that a con was taking advantage of a desperate person for money

 

it doesn't prove that proper conversion therapy fails

 

the testimonies of the converted prove otherwise

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It certainly doesn't prove it works. People with sexual disorientation disorder don't heal because of talk, or because a doctor electrocutes their brain. (electroshock abuse) .

It is like those who suffer with addictions of other sort. Drugs, alcohol. They work at not drinking. Not using drugs.

A married homosexual male isn't a heterosexual. He's a married homosexual male working at being a family man with a woman in his bed.

 

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i know there is cognitive therapy that works - there is no tearing down - there is only cognitive work - and trigger defusing - and emotional and mental rephrasing and recontextualizing

 

there is nothing tortuous about it - it is a valuable method to identify thoughts and feelings - and then measure them against truth and better thoughts and feelings that produce a strength based on truth

 

for example - if a person thinks they are born this way there is no hope - but if they realize they were influenced this way they can look at the trigger/catalyst - and then defuse the trigger catatlyst

 

but it needs to be done with a properly trained therapist

 

or it can be done with God via His power and grace - God's truth sets us free if we come to the point where we believe Him over our feelings/thoughts

 

these 2 methods do work - i know of those who have used it effectively - and it matches scripture that says to take every thought captive to the truth - 2 Corinthians 10:5

 

Yes, anyone WANTING to better their lives should be both free to do so, AND free to get help! Whether that means from a friend, Church, counselor, therapist, etc.

 

Regulate bad practices by all means, and eliminate forcible treatment; the APA is highly hypocritical to even speak to that issue, with so much abuse under their watchful eye.

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Imagine if someone tried to convert any heterosexual here to homosexuality using treatment methods.

Conversion therapy does not work. But to make the therapy centers a lot of money claiming it will.

 

 

 

This link gives more detail than the prior one.

 

Interesting that when a study affirms homosexuality as being normal, basing the study on participant's comments is lauded as being "qualitative," yet when that same approach yields results the LGBTQ doesn't like it is shunned as irresponsible and flawed.

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Interesting that when a study affirms homosexuality as being normal, basing the study on participant's comments is lauded as being "qualitative," yet when that same approach yields results the LGBTQ doesn't like it is shunned as irresponsible and flawed.

 

Well, I suppose someone who thinks an individual can be talked out of,medicated, or electrocuted to change their sexual disorientation, would be the one that is dysfunctional.

Only God can lead a fallen soul into change in this life.

 

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Well, I suppose someone who thinks an individual can be talked out of,medicated, or electrocuted to change their sexual disorientation, would be the one that is dysfunctional.

Only God can lead a fallen soul into change in this life.

 

i know of 1 non-christian that was talked out of it - and several christians that changed with counselling - which is talking

 

i think of it this way - God made everyone male or female - so if someone thinks they are something else - but God says not so - then i guess anyone's conversion via talking about the truth could be attributed to God

 

in any case the secular mental health organizations do not for sure have the truth on sexual orientation - so we should not let them talk us into converting our knowledge of the truth over to their secular untruthful knowledge of sexual orientation

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Well, I suppose someone who thinks an individual can be talked out of,medicated, or electrocuted to change their sexual disorientation, would be the one that is dysfunctional.

Only God can lead a fallen soul into change in this life.

 

Nobody said anything about being medicated or shocked out of sexual preferences, that's dishonest dialogue.

 

The issue here is God changing a life, and pending legislation that frowns on it.

 

And the related issue of children being indoctrinated with the same perverse value system, from a young age; 5 and 6, in public school. Though that is not part of this same bill, it's designed to push society in the same direction.

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