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Soul man

Carnality Vs Spirituality

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God is always bringing new life, the knowledge of your position as a son of God is the greatest revelation to be recieved by the carnal believer.

Teaching however, is a necessity for this life.

The carnal usually rebel against all teaching programs, especially if they have no gimmicks, awards, or other enticements.

But the hunger and hurt within his/her heart can become so great that it forces the carnal will into subjection, if they do, God can teach them a new life.

You can be in the ministry and be carnal, happens every day.

One reason the carnal believer rebels against new light is that immediately upon searching the scriptures they discover they are still babes, maybe after years of being in Christ, and still living on the milk.

What a blow to to those to find out such a thing.

I must add here, most are not at blame (laymen), but there are some to be blamed (leaders).

So take heed little ears what you hear, and little feet who you follow.

 

It is impossible to surrender one's life without knowledge of what is happening.

The carnal man may know all about Jesus, but not know Him, Phil. 3:10.

 

Jesus may even have a place , but not the place of supremacy.

The ignorant, unsurrendered life produces an unbearable condition.

The carnal believer is always miserable, defeated, discouraged spiritually, and often physically.

He is nervous, upset, and often psychotic, living on "man-made remedies" of one sort or another.

There is no peace until a separation from the world and a revelation of Christ as their life grips them by the HolySpirit.

Until you take your last breath the hope will always remain the same; Christ in you the hope of glory.

 

 

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You have overstated what some carnal believers are. Have you ever looked at a woman with lust, lied, were greedy (no how small) Used abusive language All these happen in a carnal state. How fast can you get out of being carnal? instantly.

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Being carnally minded goes much deeper than just being sinfully minded. Being mindful of the flesh is what carnally mindedness is. Focusing our attention on our deeds (good or bad) is being carnally minded. As Christians, Paul encourages us to stop focusing on our flesh (the good or bad that it' doing) and just focus instead on Christ and what He has done for us, who we are in Him.

 

God gave us a new Spirit, a new creature, and we should focus on the New MAN and how God sees us perfect as that new man. God is not looking at our flesh but He' looking at us Thru the Blood of Christ. We are in Christ, and as He is, so are we in this world (1 John 4:17).

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Being carnally minded goes much deeper than just being sinfully minded. Being mindful of the flesh is what carnally mindedness is. Focusing our attention on our deeds (good or bad) is being carnally minded. As Christians, Paul encourages us to stop focusing on our flesh (the good or bad that it' doing) and just focus instead on Christ and what He has done for us, who we are in Him.

 

God gave us a new Spirit, a new creature, and we should focus on the New MAN and how God sees us perfect as that new man. God is not looking at our flesh but He' looking at us Thru the Blood of Christ. We are in Christ, and as He is, so are we in this world (1 John 4:17).

 

Carnal Fleshly, of or pertaining to the body as the seat of the desires and appetites usually empolyed in Scripture in the bad sense as opposed to spiritual. In 1 Corinthians 2:14 3-3:4, Paul first divides mankind practically into two classes= the natural and the spiritual....he classifies Christians as "carnal" and 'spiritual" and lists the marks of carnality as"envying, strife, divisions" (KJV) The Zondervan Pictorial Bible Dictionary 1967

 

I do not think carnality is "Focusing on our deeds.." Its our thoughts as James says turning what we do.

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You think being carnally minded is focusing on our thoughts? Being mindful of our thoughts?

 

no, I'm pretty sure carnally minded is being mindful of what our flesh is doing. And that is what we are to stop doing. How else does Hebrews 10:2 make any sense? Once purged clean, we should have no conscience of sins. Being focused on our flesh and whether it' s being good or bad is what keeps us in sin. Focus instead on the spirit, and we dont fulfill the lust of the flesh.

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I am not sure, but perhaps we might be saying something close to the same thing. Are we? In Romans 7:14, 8:7, 1 Corinthians 3:3, 2 Corinthians 7:32 and 1 Peter 5:7 . all use the word carnal. NKJV. In James 1:14,15 there James tells how sin come into being. When we sin are we not carnal in the real sense of the word?

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Look at 1 Corinthians 3:1. Paul is calling them babes and explaining to them that he cant speak of spiritual things because they wont understand it. Also look at Romans 8:9, but ye ARE NOT of the flesh but of the spirit if the spirit dwells in you...

 

my point is that as Christians, we are not carnal but spiritual, however we can still focus our attention on our flesh (that is what it means to be carnally minded: focusing on the flesh either for good reason or bad) but that is what causes us to get caught up in sin, like lust. Focusing all our thoughts on Christ, and what He has done for us, and who we are in Him is being Spiritually Minded.

 

Understanding righteousness ( that we are righteous because of what Christ has done, and not by what we do or don't do) is what separates the adults from the babes, as Paul puts it. Hebrews 5:13

 

I'm not sure if be carnally minded is being sinful, per se, but it does lead to sinfulness.

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But to be carnal minded is death, in Romans. So is a Christian that remain carnal minded dead, unless he changes? We can't be encouraging people to become carnal Christian, thus giving them a license to commit sin willfullly. My father was carnal minded and a Christian. Spent the majority of his life away from church, living how he wanted. Not reading the Bible. Too me, he looked no different than a non believer, and yes, this put many doubts in our hearts, that he would be saved. Disowning his own children. Running after greed. Too me, a Christian is to have a change of heart and be fruitful. My father was neither fruitful nor changing. And to some, that is a sign of a non believer. Even the Bible says this. And no one is for sure he sincerely gave his heart to God. If he did not, he is no Christian.

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But to be carnal minded is death, in Romans. So is a Christian that remain carnal minded dead, unless he changes? We can't be encouraging people to become carnal Christian, thus giving them a license to commit sin willfullly. My father was carnal minded and a Christian. Spent the majority of his life away from church, living how he wanted. Not reading the Bible. Too me, he looked no different than a non believer, and yes, this put many doubts in our hearts, that he would be saved. Disowning his own children. Running after greed. Too me, a Christian is to have a change of heart and be fruitful. My father was neither fruitful nor changing. And to some, that is a sign of a non believer. Even the Bible says this. And no one is for sure he sincerely gave his heart to God. If he did not, he is no Christian.

 

Hi Charles, welcome to Christforums!

 

Every born again believer has been made alive Ephesians 2:5 and a new heart after God's beats in his chest Ezekiel 36:25-27. However, I think we must demonstrate patience towards our brethren as sanctification is a life long process. Tis why we are reminded to forgive so much 70x7. Some of us are steeped deeper than others in sin, and some have decades of habitual patterns of behavior to overcome. We are not glorified instantaneously, but rather at the end of our lives.

 

And while I catch your drift and understand fully what you're suggesting, I do not believe one even needs to believe in God to be a Christian. While the term Christian was later created in Antioch after Judas hung himself I do not think anyone would have an issue with calling him a disciple or a Christian. Lots of people start out in the faith with reservations and doubts or even unbelief, an unbelief most all of us demonstrated when at enmity against God.

 

One thing I have learned over the years is that there is a fundamental difference between those born again or regenerated and a learner or follower of Christ. I don't try to figure it out anymore, but I do know that the saints shall persevere to the last day in faith.

 

This is not to say we can't know each other by fruits, I'm just suggesting that not all of us bear fruit as quickly as others, and that all are in season. No doubt I have met plenty of people with a disconnect somewhere between the heart and mind, but the mind is not transformed over night, but by the word of God. I mean I wish I could receive some special type of matrix download where my mind's software was completely updated to version 2.0 in an instant.

 

God bless,

William

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But to be carnal minded is death, in Romans. So is a Christian that remain carnal minded dead, unless he changes? We can't be encouraging people to become carnal Christian, thus giving them a license to commit sin willfullly. My father was carnal minded and a Christian. Spent the majority of his life away from church, living how he wanted. Not reading the Bible. Too me, he looked no different than a non believer, and yes, this put many doubts in our hearts, that he would be saved. Disowning his own children. Running after greed. Too me, a Christian is to have a change of heart and be fruitful. My father was neither fruitful nor changing. And to some, that is a sign of a non believer. Even the Bible says this. And no one is for sure he sincerely gave his heart to God. If he did not, he is no Christian.

 

CharlesC Welcome to the forum. Thank you for sharing your story about your father. My father was a man that was always angry at everything. I don't think I ever pleased him. I too never saw him open a Bible, he used the LORDs name as a swear word all his life. But he want to church once a week and tithed. My mother was the strong influence on my life in Christ. I never missed a Sunday School or Church or Wednesday night prayer meeting up until I joined the Navy. I know my dad knew about Jesus. I have come to the conclusion that when he died he was in the hands of being face to God I have no real idea where he is now.

 

 

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Jesus said that anyone who believes in Him, will have eternal life. My dad was a lot the same right up until the end. He was the great pretender. On his death bed he was afraid of what was coming and then gave his life to Christ fully. He basically begged for mercy and forgivenss . I told him he already had it, he had it all along. My dad never knew who he was in Christ, but that dfidnt change the fact that he was righteous in Christ, it just caused him to behave in a way that confirmed his own self condemnation (Titus 3:11).

 

this is what Jesus meant when He said "first clean the inside of the dish (change the way you believe --which is what REPENT means) and the outside will be clean (actions and behaviors) also. He didn' say first clean up the inside then clean the outside. No, He said the outside will be clean. Too many Christians focus on cleaning up the outside (being carnally minded: focusing more on the flesh than on Christ) and not enough of the fact that Christ has cleaned them on the inside. When you know you're clean and dressed, the last thing you want to do is jump in a mud puddle. If you dont know youre clean, Why not jump?

 

Anyway, I got tired of all the pretending and I told God that I didn' love Him. I wanted to, but I didn' know how. Maybe I just didn' know Him well enough. But i asked to show me what im missing. What i didnt know that so many others seemed to know. And Boy, did He.

 

I didn' know how much He loved me. How precious I am to Him. How much value He placed on me. He loves me the same as He loves Christ (John 17:23). That was my life changer once it went from my head to my heart. We love Him, because He first loved us. We can' love Him fully until we understand how much He loves us. Then, when we understand and are established in His love for us, we are filled with the fullness of God. Ephesians 3:17-19.

 

Its not about our sin nature, and whether or not we remain focused on that part of us. It' about Him. It' all about Christ. Focusing on sin (even trying to overcome) takes focus off of Christ.

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Have to agree with some that sanctification is an on going process, you cannot judge another by their lifestyle.

That is popular preaching in religion but it fails to appropriate the cross.

basically that is what this message is about, don't judge, religion has turned Christianity into exactly that, a big religion.

If we don't live up to a standard we are not saved, if we live up to a standard we are saved, and the standards are no different than have been handed down through the ages it is just white-washed to fit our generation, it is the same old dark age premise.

The hour will come once again the scripture says when "men will kill you and think they do God a service."

Just because you don't believe exactly the way they believe, or behave the way they behave, it is nothing more than a religious hierarchy ruling over another human being.

Christians are notorious for crucifying their wounded.

We all have our favorite preacher, favorite teacher, favorite religious action, but you had best beware of what is happening because you are not exempt from this type of mindset and mentality that strikes mankind.

The world is watching, preaching one thing and doing another.

Telling them they need Jesus that he loves them, and then we show no love.

You cannot judge the brethren nor the world, you are called to love.

How can you say you love God when you don't even love the brethren.

 

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We love God because He first loved us. And This is love, not that we love God, but that He loves us. We will never love God the way He loves us, just like a new born baby will never love his parents the way He is loved by them. It' not until we realize how much He loves us, do when begin to love Him back. The more we grow in understanding of His love for us, the more we grow to love Him. In turn, we also grow to care about and love the things He cares about and loves--like people.

 

we can, and often do, act as if we love others. We may convince them we love them, we may even convince ourselves, but we will never have that unyielding, unconditional love that God has for us, for others until we have the love of the Father in us: until we know in our heart, not just in our head, He loves us.

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We love God because He first loved us. And This is love, not that we love God, but that He loves us. We will never love God the way He loves us, just like a new born baby will never love his parents the way He is loved by them. It' not until we realize how much He loves us, do when begin to love Him back. The more we grow in understanding of His love for us, the more we grow to love Him. In turn, we also grow to care about and love the things He cares about and loves--like people.

 

we can, and often do, act as if we love others. We may convince them we love them, we may even convince ourselves, but we will never have that unyielding, unconditional love that God has for us, for others until we have the love of the Father in us: until we know in our heart, not just in our head, He loves us.

 

I understand your thinking, but that is what the Christ-life message is all about.

check out the fruit of the Spirit again and see how that may be applied, thanks.

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