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  • Stuff that needs to be said

    We Christians like to talk about Hell a lot, so let’s talk about Hell a little.

    Yesterday, in the very first few daylight hours after the election victory it began:

    Near San Francisco, a home in Noe Valley flew a nazi flag where kids walk by to get to school.
    A white middle school student brought a Trump sign to school and told a black classmate it was time for him to get “back in place”.
    A gay New York City man getting on a bus was told that he should “Enjoy the concentration camps, faggot!”
    The NYU Muslim Students Association found the word “Trump!” scrawled on the door of their prayer room.
    A female seminary student was stopped at a coffee shop with the words, “Smile sweetheart, we beat the [edit].”
    Parents of children of color spent the day picking up their children early from elementary, middle, and high schools across the country because they were inundated with slurs and harassment and unable to study.
    A group of Hispanic kids in Raleigh were taunted by white children, telling them they were “going back to Mexico.”
    This is the personal Hell we’ve unleashed upon our people this week.

    And if you’re a white Christian and you voted for this: You need to fix this. Now.

    You comprise the lion’s share of Trump’s elevation to the highest office of our country.
    You knew exactly who this man was while you held your noses and covered your eyes and endorsed him anyway.
    You are fully responsible for the flood of personal sewage now engulfing children and adults of color, those in the LGBTQ community, those in the Muslim community.
    And you, white Christian, better get you spiritual [edit] together and figure out how you’re going make this right.
    Let’s be clear about something, brethren:

    This is not the time to appeal to minorities and marginalized communities to “come together in unity”. That was Hillary Clinton’s message, and even though she had the track record and the experience and the wherewithal to make it happen—you passed on it. Instead you chose the guy who’s entire resume is about supremacy and privilege, whose entire campaign was about the fear of the other (the other in this case, being anyone not white, straight, and Christian). You chose the guy endorsed by the KKK. You did.

    You need to understand this.
    Oppressed people aren’t obliged to make nice with their oppressors.
    The bullied don’t owe anything to the bullies.
    Victims don’t have to make their assailants feel better.
    Young children of color aren’t responsible to educate racists children.
    In the 25th chapter of Matthew’s Gospel, Jesus tells his followers, those who followed after him, that those who would bear his name are to love the least; not those who are less-than, but those who are treated as less-than. He then paints the picture of the eternal suffering Christians are always so willing to condemn others to, and he says that it will be their lack of love and compassion and mercy for these most vulnerable, most hurting people—that will condemn them.
    White Christians and the white Church, especially if you voted for Donald Trump: this is all on you.

    Your pastors need to speak clearly and explicitly into this, now.
    Your church websites and social media pages need to address this harassment and bullying and terrorizing, now.
    You need to talk to your white children and teach them how not not be horrible to other kids, and how to stand up to those who are being horrible, now.
    You need to talk to your kid’s coaches and to your midweek Bible Study and to your co-workers and your church staff and your gun club—and you need to call this poison out, now.
    White churches, this Sunday, your only sermon should be the one that reminds your white members what the parable of the Good Samaritan was compelling followers of Jesus to be: radically merciful when everyone else looked the other way.
    You need to reach out to your neighbors and coworkers and classmates and social media friends who are part of marginalized communities and reassure them, listen to them, care for them, be Jesus to them.

    If not, no matter how you rationalize it or try to squeeze your way out of it, the personal Hell so many people are living in and will continue to live in over the next four years, will be one of your design.
    It will be your shared sin.
    The blood will be on your hands...

  • #2
    Quite the inflammatory troll we have going on here.

    Who said that Christians as a whole are responsible for individuals who decide to act the way you describe?

    You are making quite a few accusations, but do not identify where you fall in all of this.

    True Christians do not condone the behavior you have highlighted. And while you are criticizing those who may have supported Trump, are you also criticizing those people who are causing property damage all over this country because they are upset their person lost? How is that any better than the situations you describe?
    Comment>

    • #3
      Hello MrPav, and welcome to CF!

      What about all the liberals? Have you been reading the news in California? I live here, and throughout the state liberals are protesting by setting fires, breaking windows, and destroying property, though, some peacefully. And you are wrong about the KKK: Grand Dragon Endorses Hillary

      What you are suggesting is plain ignorance by Trump supporters in your examples. There are lots of liberals doing the same thing. Matter of fact my wife went to work yesterday and was greeted by hostility towards those that voted for Trump. People in the workplace expressed that Trump supporters are uneducated losers etc.

      Mind you this is a work place that has crammed the LGBTQ down the employees throats, and like the culture that has shifted so far left, educational institutions under threat by the Obama administration had to embrace liberal ideology or lose funding.

      I do think it is good that you are spreading awareness about this kind of ignorant behavior. And you are right about one thing, this place is the closest some will ever get to heaven, and the closest others come to hell. Using your loose analogy, many Christians and especially white Christians have been living in a time that is hellish. We have watched our nation become quite divisive (no doubt fueled by the left) and oppressive towards our faith in the last eight years.

      While I sympathize with the young children caught up in all this, I do not feel sympathy for those that voted against our faith, and those that voted to murder the innocent unborn or to set policies which would further oppress the practice of the Christian faith. I will however, pray, for what I consider, enemies of the Church as I then did and still do now.

      Coming here to post this is like preaching to the choir. We neither condone these actions or involve ourselves in them. For eight years we have "tolerated" great injustice, but I'm lost as to your logic, because I didn't even think about going to our brethren in the black community during these last eight years asking them to say what you shared. Our brethren are not worldly as those are outside the church.

      God bless,
      William
      Comment>

      • #4
        President Obama and Secretary Clinton have spoken. Perhaps we need to consider what they're saying and follow their lead!!
        “Donald Trump is going to be our president. We owe him an open mind and the chance to lead.” ~Hillary Rodham Clinton

        “Last night I congratulated Donald Trump and offered to work with him on behalf of our country. I hope that he will be a successful president for all Americans.” ~Hillary Rodham Clinton

        The presidency is bigger than any one person, President Obama said Wednesday, adding that "we are all rooting" for President-elect Donald Trump to be successful.
        Last edited by David Lee; 11-10-2016, 05:05 PM.
        Simul Justus et Peccator ~Martin Luther

        "We are justified by faith alone, but the faith that justifies is never alone" ~John Calvin

        "The Christian does not think God will love us because we are good, but that God will make us good because He loves us." ~C. S. Lewis

        "The secret is Christ in me, not me in a different set of circumstances" ~Elisabeth Elliot

        "The law is for the self-righteous to humble their pride; the Gospel is for the lost to remove their despair. ~C. H. Spurgeon
        Comment>

        • #5
          You are outraged over injustice. So am I!!!



          I doubt if those people even know who that man voted for but it sure did not stop them. Just look at those brave souls and notice the one trying to steal something from the car. No doubt they feel very proud.
          Comment>

          • #6
            Originally posted by mrpavlovich View Post
            We Christians like to talk about Hell a lot, so let’s talk about Hell a little.

            Yesterday, in the very first few daylight hours after the election victory it began:

            Near San Francisco, a home in Noe Valley flew a nazi flag where kids walk by to get to school.
            A white middle school student brought a Trump sign to school and told a black classmate it was time for him to get “back in place”.
            A gay New York City man getting on a bus was told that he should “Enjoy the concentration camps, faggot!”
            The NYU Muslim Students Association found the word “Trump!” scrawled on the door of their prayer room.
            A female seminary student was stopped at a coffee shop with the words, “Smile sweetheart, we beat the [edit].”
            Parents of children of color spent the day picking up their children early from elementary, middle, and high schools across the country because they were inundated with slurs and harassment and unable to study.
            A group of Hispanic kids in Raleigh were taunted by white children, telling them they were “going back to Mexico.”
            This is the personal Hell we’ve unleashed upon our people this week.

            And if you’re a white Christian and you voted for this: You need to fix this. Now.

            You comprise the lion’s share of Trump’s elevation to the highest office of our country.
            You knew exactly who this man was while you held your noses and covered your eyes and endorsed him anyway.
            You are fully responsible for the flood of personal sewage now engulfing children and adults of color, those in the LGBTQ community, those in the Muslim community.
            And you, white Christian, better get you spiritual [edit] together and figure out how you’re going make this right.
            Let’s be clear about something, brethren:

            This is not the time to appeal to minorities and marginalized communities to “come together in unity”. That was Hillary Clinton’s message, and even though she had the track record and the experience and the wherewithal to make it happen—you passed on it. Instead you chose the guy who’s entire resume is about supremacy and privilege, whose entire campaign was about the fear of the other (the other in this case, being anyone not white, straight, and Christian). You chose the guy endorsed by the KKK. You did.

            You need to understand this.
            Oppressed people aren’t obliged to make nice with their oppressors.
            The bullied don’t owe anything to the bullies.
            Victims don’t have to make their assailants feel better.
            Young children of color aren’t responsible to educate racists children.
            In the 25th chapter of Matthew’s Gospel, Jesus tells his followers, those who followed after him, that those who would bear his name are to love the least; not those who are less-than, but those who are treated as less-than. He then paints the picture of the eternal suffering Christians are always so willing to condemn others to, and he says that it will be their lack of love and compassion and mercy for these most vulnerable, most hurting people—that will condemn them.
            White Christians and the white Church, especially if you voted for Donald Trump: this is all on you.

            Your pastors need to speak clearly and explicitly into this, now.
            Your church websites and social media pages need to address this harassment and bullying and terrorizing, now.
            You need to talk to your white children and teach them how not not be horrible to other kids, and how to stand up to those who are being horrible, now.
            You need to talk to your kid’s coaches and to your midweek Bible Study and to your co-workers and your church staff and your gun club—and you need to call this poison out, now.
            White churches, this Sunday, your only sermon should be the one that reminds your white members what the parable of the Good Samaritan was compelling followers of Jesus to be: radically merciful when everyone else looked the other way.
            You need to reach out to your neighbors and coworkers and classmates and social media friends who are part of marginalized communities and reassure them, listen to them, care for them, be Jesus to them.

            If not, no matter how you rationalize it or try to squeeze your way out of it, the personal Hell so many people are living in and will continue to live in over the next four years, will be one of your design.
            It will be your shared sin.
            The blood will be on your hands...
            I must admit that your post is done with passion and I find you sincere with what you have written. But, you mentioned the kids. Think about it.
            Kids!
            While your logic might have some real value I see nothing in response to one of the greatest things that Jesus ever taught. Greatest because He said, "What you have done to the least of these, you have done to me also.". In other words, when you mangle, dismember and murder children still in the womb you are doing the same thing to HIM!

            Where is the same passion about abortion? Jesus didn't really care as much about politics or any other subject more than the treatment of children yet you manage to place kids in the middle of a political agenda rather than their place in the Kingdom of God.
            You cannot teach children who are dead.....simple as that.

            I am SURE, that even though the only unforgivable sin is the blaspheming of the Holy Spirit that killing the yet unborn is right up there in a close second place.
            The left seems all too willing for that type of blood to be on their hands and frankly, whether you're black, white, indigo or green, it's an extreme stretch for me to believe that anyone who would take a yet to be born, living human being's life cannot in any way be considered a follower of the Christ.

            May God Bless...............Bobby







            Comment>

            • #7
              Well, I pretty much called it. The OP dropped this off here then moved on to other forums to do the same without following up. Typical troll.
              Comment>

              • #8
                Originally posted by Knotical View Post
                Well, I pretty much called it. The OP dropped this off here then moved on to other forums to do the same without following up. Typical troll.
                You were right.

                Comment>

                • #9
                  Some of what the news is reporting tries to paint Nationalist or those that pride themselves and are loyal (Patriot) to their country as the KKK: North Carolina KKK group to hold 'Victory Parade' for President-elect Donald Trump

                  Of course, the video automatically starts when you visit the news page: ;)

                  I'm sure incidents like the video Origen posted do not help the black community as well the above article does not help white communities.

                  God bless,
                  William
                  Comment>

                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Origen View Post
                    You are outraged over injustice. So am I!!!



                    I doubt if those people even know who that man voted for but it sure did not stop them. Just look at those brave souls and notice the one trying to steal something from the car. No doubt they feel very proud.
                    Can you imagine the media escalation if that elderly gent pulled out a .45 and started mowing down those thugs in self-defense? The way those people acted reminds me of when I was in school. I always had to keep one eye on my back while fighting another because you never knew who would come up from behind - no honor among some.

                    Anyhoot, we know that Black Lives Matter, and Black Panthers can march in a positive way, but no, not the Klan. Good ridden Political Correctness.

                    God bless,
                    William
                    Comment>

                    • #11
                      Can you imagine what the response would have been if a gang of kids had beaten up an old guy just because he had a "Hillary" bumper sticker on his car instead of a Trump bumper sticker? We would have never heard the end of the outrage, but I've heard almost nothing about this incident or any of the other similar, incidents that have occurred since then. (BTW, the video doesn't show everything that happened. The kids ended up stealing that old man's car as well).

                      We need to continue to pray daily for this great country of ours.
                      Simul Justus et Peccator ~Martin Luther

                      "We are justified by faith alone, but the faith that justifies is never alone" ~John Calvin

                      "The Christian does not think God will love us because we are good, but that God will make us good because He loves us." ~C. S. Lewis

                      "The secret is Christ in me, not me in a different set of circumstances" ~Elisabeth Elliot

                      "The law is for the self-righteous to humble their pride; the Gospel is for the lost to remove their despair. ~C. H. Spurgeon
                      Comment>

                      • #12
                        Originally posted by David Lee View Post
                        Can you imagine what the response would have been if a gang of kids had beaten up an old guy just because he had a "Hillary" bumper sticker on his car? We would have never heard the end of the outrage, but I've heard almost nothing about this incident or any of the other similar, incidents that have occurred since then.

                        We need to continue to pray daily for this great country of ours.
                        You're right David, we should continue to pray because it is not over until the Hyper-food-il-ated lady sings. That's my politically correct crack. Ya'know, like calling someone a Hyper-Calvinist rather than a heretic :eek: eh, never-mind. Good riddens Political Correctness.

                        God bless,
                        William
                        Comment>

                        • #13
                          Originally posted by William View Post
                          Good riddens Political Correctness.
                          If only :(

                          Simul Justus et Peccator ~Martin Luther

                          "We are justified by faith alone, but the faith that justifies is never alone" ~John Calvin

                          "The Christian does not think God will love us because we are good, but that God will make us good because He loves us." ~C. S. Lewis

                          "The secret is Christ in me, not me in a different set of circumstances" ~Elisabeth Elliot

                          "The law is for the self-righteous to humble their pride; the Gospel is for the lost to remove their despair. ~C. H. Spurgeon
                          Comment>

                          • #14
                            Originally posted by William View Post
                            ...it is not over until the Hyper-food-il-ated lady sings.
                            :rolleyes: :D

                            William, you crack me up :)

                            Simul Justus et Peccator ~Martin Luther

                            "We are justified by faith alone, but the faith that justifies is never alone" ~John Calvin

                            "The Christian does not think God will love us because we are good, but that God will make us good because He loves us." ~C. S. Lewis

                            "The secret is Christ in me, not me in a different set of circumstances" ~Elisabeth Elliot

                            "The law is for the self-righteous to humble their pride; the Gospel is for the lost to remove their despair. ~C. H. Spurgeon
                            Comment>
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