Dos and Don'ts, all we need to know is the Bible; however, not all is covered explicitly. Discuss how Christians should act or what they should do when facing divorce, smoking, and other issues.

The greatest commandment is love

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  • The greatest commandment is love

    This has bothered me since I was in junior high. We, as Christians, are called to love everyone. So why do we shun people that have lifestyles that we don't approve of? LGBT is a good example. I am not saying that we should condone what they are doing but the disgust that they are met with from the Christian community is appalling.
    At the same time we pick and choose. The majority of Christians take serious issue with the LGBT community but barely bat an eye when someone is divorced even if it's not for a good reason.
    I know some LGBT people claim to be Christians at the same time. Yes we should tell them that they are living in sin and that they should change their ways, but we should do so lovingly; and if they don't claim to be Christians then, at most, we should let them know that we disagree with their lifestyles and their choices but that we still love and accept them as people.
    The Bible says that sin is sin is sin. If we accepted that as truth and treated all sinners with disgust there would be no fellowship, no community, and no brotherly love.
    The bottom line is that we should love people no matter what. That is what we were called to do and, if we do that properly, every other commandment will be easy to follow under that one. Loving others will push us to not lie, murder, steal, cheat, etc.
    This world is so infected with hate. Everyone has to hate something. Why?
    Maybe in stead of trying to become "better" people we should try to become less of the bad things: anger, hatred, conceded, vain, etc.

  • #2
    Originally posted by Angd1216 View Post
    This has bothered me since I was in junior high. We, as Christians, are called to love everyone. So why do we shun people that have lifestyles that we don't approve of? LGBT is a good example. I am not saying that we should condone what they are doing but the disgust that they are met with from the Christian community is appalling.
    At the same time we pick and choose. The majority of Christians take serious issue with the LGBT community but barely bat an eye when someone is divorced even if it's not for a good reason.
    I know some LGBT people claim to be Christians at the same time. Yes we should tell them that they are living in sin and that they should change their ways, but we should do so lovingly; and if they don't claim to be Christians then, at most, we should let them know that we disagree with their lifestyles and their choices but that we still love and accept them as people.
    The Bible says that sin is sin is sin. If we accepted that as truth and treated all sinners with disgust there would be no fellowship, no community, and no brotherly love.
    The bottom line is that we should love people no matter what. That is what we were called to do and, if we do that properly, every other commandment will be easy to follow under that one. Loving others will push us to not lie, murder, steal, cheat, etc.
    This world is so infected with hate. Everyone has to hate something. Why?
    Maybe in stead of trying to become "better" people we should try to become less of the bad things: anger, hatred, conceded, vain, etc.
    You mean like this:






    I think you're preaching to the choir here, but I do agree that we should love and pray for our enemies. Maybe some of us need to be reminded from time to time. Lets look at where intolerance has us now, lets look at how secular society loves us Christians:
    1. FREE SPEECH AND DISCRIMINATION DUE TO RELIGIOUS BELIEFS
      1. Christian fired for refusing sex therapy to homosexual couples.
        1. "The next hearing will be this Thursday, when Christian relationship counselor Gary McFarlane will appeal his firing for refusing sex therapy to homosexual couples. Last week, Christian nurse Shirley Chaplin lost her appeal to wear a crucifix around her neck in hospital wards."
          1. Christianity Today | Theology, Church, Culture
      2. Fla. Teacher Suspended for Posting Anti-Gay Marriage Views on Facebook
        1. "'It was my own personal comment on my own personal time on my own personal computer in my own personal house, exercising what I believed as a social studies teacher to be my First Amendment rights,' Buell told Fox."
        2. "Chris Patton, a communications officer for the school system, told Fox there was concern about how Buell might treat gay students in his class. He also disputed the notion that the comments were private.
          “He has [more than] 700 friends,” Patton said. “How private is that – really? Social media can be troubling if you don’t respect it and know that just because you think you are in a private realm – it’s not private.”
          He vowed Buell will not return to the classroom until “a thorough job of looking at everything – past or previous writings” is complete.
          1. IIS 7.5 Detailed Error - 404.0 - Not Found
      3. School suspends a black woman who objected to the idea that homosexuality is a civil right.
        1. "The University of Toledo has taken action against an administrator that has aroused concern over free-speech violations. The victim is the school's associate vice president of human resources, Crystal Dixon, who wrote to a local newspaper in response to an article that claimed homosexuals to be victims of civil rights abuses. In the letter, Dixon -- who is black -- objected to the article's claim that homosexual civil rights are being trampled on. In her view, civil rights and homosexuality do not fit into the same box."
        2. Matt Barber of Concerned Women for America is outraged that the University of Toledo would suspend her over the letter....the entire incident is "inappropriate and has a chilling effect on free speech."
          1. Link
      4. Texas School punishes Christian teen for voicing his opinion against homosexuality
        1. "An honors student in Fort Worth, Texas, was sent to the principal’s office and punished for telling a classmate that he believes homosexuality is wrong... Dakota was in a German class at the high school when the conversation shifted to religion and homosexuality in Germany. At some point during the conversation, he turned to a friend and said that he was a Christian and “being a homosexual is wrong.” “It wasn’t directed to anyone except my friend who was sitting behind me,” Dakota told Fox. “I guess [the teacher] heard me. He started yelling. He told me he was going to write me an infraction and send me to the office.”
          1. Texas School Punishes Boy for Opposing Homosexuality | Fox News
      5. University removes Christian from counseling program due to his belief that homosexuality is immoral
        1. Article Titled: Is Discrimination Against Christians Legal? 7/20/2010. "A federal judge has ruled in favor of a public university that removed a Christian student from its graduate program in school counseling over her belief that homosexuality is morally wrong. Monday’s ruling, according to Julea Ward’s attorneys, could result in Christian students across the country being expelled from public university for similar views."
          1. Is Discrimination Against Christians Legal?
    2. GAY ACTIVISTS ON THE ATTACK
      1. Attacking Christian Charities
        1. 'Gay' activists kill cash sources for Christian charities. Internet-based campaigns scare away corporate donors with 'hate group' charge
          1. ‘Gay’ activists kill cash sources for Christian charities
      2. Bricks thrown through door and windows of Christian facility
        1. "Police are searching for the culprits who threw concrete bricks through the door and windows of a Christian facility in Illinois as it prepared for a banquet for a group dedicated to exposing the homosexual activist agenda....LaBarbera notes that a left-wing website with a letter from a group of homosexuals taking credit for the attack warns that more will follow if the host site for the banquet does not disassociate from its featured speaker, Scott Lively, and AFTAH.
          1. Link
      3. Pressuring Paypal.com to not handle traditional value groups
        1. "Homosexual activists are pressuring PayPal to not handle donations made to groups that promote traditional values...Founder Peter LaBarbera [of Americans for Truth About Homosexuality] refers to it as "homofascism in action," as it asks people to stop financially supporting Christian groups, which the homosexual activists refer to as "hate groups."
          1. Link
        2. "PayPal officially states that its users "may not use the PayPal service for activities that [...] promote hate, violence, racial intolerance" but PayPal has become a favorite payment service for anti-LGBT extremists all over the world. PayPal must act immediately to shut down their accounts and ban all sites that promote anti-LGBT hate.
          1. Page not found - All Out
    3. GENERAL
      1. "Stern says if the early cases are any guide, the outlook is grim for religious groups. A few cases: Yeshiva University was ordered to allow same-sex couples in its married dormitory. A Christian school has been sued for expelling two allegedly lesbian students. Catholic Charities abandoned its adoption service in Massachusetts after it was told to place children with same-sex couples. The same happened with a private company operating in California."
        1. Gay Rights, Religious Liberties: A Three-Act Story : NPR
    4. MUSIC
      1. The band The Dire Straights song "Money for Nothing" banned due to word "faggot".
        1. "The Dire Straits hit Money for Nothing can now be played in Canada after a ban for its use of the word ‘faggot’ was lifted. The song from the 1980s was pulled from radio playlists in January after just one unidentified listener complained about the use of the slang word for homosexual."
        2. Read more: Dire Straits song ban lifted in Canada | Daily Mail Online


    Source: Examples of persecution of people who do not agree with homosexuality | carm
    Comment>

    • #3
      Hi Angd1216, first off, WELCOME TO CF :) and thanks for joining us here!

      As for your first question above, "why do we shun people that have lifestyles that we don't approve of?", if you don't mind me asking, who, specifically, are you referring to? Do members of your church openly "shun" members of the LGBT community because they are gay? I know my church and its members do not (nor have any of the churches and/or denominations I've attended in the past). In fact, the last denomination I was part of, the PCUSA, openly ordains homosexual ministers and performs gay marriages now. And while openly gay men and women would not be eligible to be ordained as pastors in the denomination and church that I belong to now, ALL are welcome to attend our worship services and Bible studies, etc. We don't "shun" anyone.

      And quite frankly, outside of the Westboro Baptist Church in Kansas, this is the norm (at least in my experience, it is).

      However, if you have evidence that your accusation against Christianity, in general, is true, please share it with us, because I would definitely like to know about it.

      Yours and His,
      David
      p.s. - I've also never been part of a church that considers divorce a non-issue or not sinful. In fact, all the churches I've belonged to take it very seriously, and a number of the offending spouses have, over the years, been told to repent or leave (and unlike members of the LGBT community, they aren't welcome to return to church until they do). How does your church deal with this issue?
      Simul Justus et Peccator ~Martin Luther

      "We are justified by faith alone, but the faith that justifies is never alone" ~John Calvin

      "The Christian does not think God will love us because we are good, but that God will make us good because He loves us." ~C. S. Lewis

      "The secret is Christ in me, not me in a different set of circumstances" ~Elisabeth Elliot

      "The law is for the self-righteous to humble their pride; the Gospel is for the lost to remove their despair. ~C. H. Spurgeon
      Comment>

      • #4
        I haven't seen this in my church. Everyone is loving and accepting, even if they may not necessarily agree with people's way of life. For instance, our entire congregation was in tears when Orlando happened...our hearts were broken. We ached for those people who lost their lives, and for their families and friends that were left asking why. Friends of mine even ordered bottled water on Amazon to be delivered to the blood donation center that was advertised as having long queues in the Orlando area, as it was mentioned they were running low on supplies for those waiting to donate.

        I always think it's important to LOVE and to show that love - I am human and I am not to judge anyone! I never understood when online I saw so called Christians preaching hate or judging others - I think though that's the minority, and I do think social media these days brings out the worst in some people! I try not to let viral posts spreading hateful messages impact my perception of all Christians.
        Comment>

        • #5
          Lemme say that I agree with you in that we should be motivated by love.

          Originally posted by amelia88 View Post
          I am human and I am not to judge anyone!
          I find no Scriptural basis for this though. We are to make moral judgments righteously and not superficially.

          Lastly, there is a difference between what you and St. Worm are conveying. There is a thing called church discipline. An example of church discipline can be found in 1 Corinthians 5. Depending on the form of church government, different denominations will handle church discipline accordingly. Does your church have only attendees or also membership? Does your church discipline members and hold them accountable in both life and doctrine according to Scripture? 1 Corinthians 5:

          5 It is actually reported that there is sexual immorality among you, and of a kind that is not tolerated even among pagans, for a man has his father's wife. 2 And you are arrogant! Ought you not rather to mourn? Let him who has done this be removed from among you.

          3 For though absent in body, I am present in spirit; and as if present, I have already pronounced judgment on the one who did such a thing. 4 When you are assembled in the name of the Lord Jesus and my spirit is present, with the power of our Lord Jesus, 5 you are to deliver this man to Satan for the destruction of the flesh, so that his spirit may be saved in the day of the Lord.[a]

          6 Your boasting is not good. Do you not know that a little leaven leavens the whole lump? 7 Cleanse out the old leaven that you may be a new lump, as you really are unleavened. For Christ, our Passover lamb, has been sacrificed. 8 Let us therefore celebrate the festival, not with the old leaven, the leaven of malice and evil, but with the unleavened bread of sincerity and truth.

          9 I wrote to you in my letter not to associate with sexually immoral people— 10 not at all meaning the sexually immoral of this world, or the greedy and swindlers, or idolaters, since then you would need to go out of the world. 11 But now I am writing to you not to associate with anyone who bears the name of brother if he is guilty of sexual immorality or greed, or is an idolater, reviler, drunkard, or swindler—not even to eat with such a one. 12 For what have I to do with judging outsiders? Is it not those inside the church[b] whom you are to judge? 13 God judges[c] those outside. “Purge the evil person from among you.”
          God bless,
          William
          Comment>

          • #6
            Hi Amelia, you reminded me about one of the big, openly Christian restaurant chains, Chic-Fil-a, and how they quietly decided to do what they never do at any of their restaurants, ever, they opened the doors of their location near the Pulse Night Club on Sunday. And not only did they open up for business, they served their food and beverages for free.
            Workers from the Chick-fil-A Lee Vista in Orlando, Florida, went to work Sunday to offer free food to those lining up to give blood and to help those injured in the shooting at LGBT club Pulse. ~Huffington Post
            Again, this is an openly Christian business. If what Angd1216 says is true of Christians, why would Chic-Fil-a choose to do such a thing?
            Simul Justus et Peccator ~Martin Luther

            "We are justified by faith alone, but the faith that justifies is never alone" ~John Calvin

            "The Christian does not think God will love us because we are good, but that God will make us good because He loves us." ~C. S. Lewis

            "The secret is Christ in me, not me in a different set of circumstances" ~Elisabeth Elliot

            "The law is for the self-righteous to humble their pride; the Gospel is for the lost to remove their despair. ~C. H. Spurgeon
            Comment>

            • #7
              Jesus instructed His disciples to leave any village that rejected them or their message. That can be applied today . . . how the church should deal with those who aren't willing to obey God's commandments. Talk to them, inform them that God doesn't like homosexuality and if they aren't willing to change then there's no reason to associate yourself with them. Whoever is not with us is against us. So if they aren't obeying God, who is their master?
              Comment>

              • #8
                Originally posted by St_Worm2 View Post
                Hi Amelia, you reminded me about one of the big, openly Christian restaurant chains, Chic-Fil-a, and how they quietly decided to do what they never do at any of their restaurants, ever, they opened the doors of their location near the Pulse Night Club on Sunday. And not only did they open up for business, they served their food and beverages for free.
                Workers from the Chick-fil-A Lee Vista in Orlando, Florida, went to work Sunday to offer free food to those lining up to give blood and to help those injured in the shooting at LGBT club Pulse. ~Huffington Post
                Again, this is an openly Christian business. If what Angd1216 says is true of Christians, why would Chic-Fil-a choose to do such a thing?

                Yes! I saw all about this in the news, too!

                I thought it was wonderful. You don't have to agree with someone's views to show them love. In fact, showing love to me is one way to BRING people to a church, and to show them the love of Christ!

                Reminds me of another quote...the church is a hospital for sinners, not a museum for saints ;)
                Comment>
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