Any Lutherans here?

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  • Any Lutherans here?

    ...besides me? And I'm new! :)

  • #2
    Welcome RevT!!!

    I am only aware of one other Lutheran (Missouri Synod) but he hasn't been around for months. stevenoza

    God bless,
    William
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    • #3
      Thanks for that....all good to know brother!
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      • #4
        Hi RevT,

        I definitely hope we attract more Lutherans. This particular site is less than a year old. Reformed are always welcome!!!

        I'd love to learn more about the Lutheran denomination.

        God bless,
        William
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        • #5
          Hey William....sounds good to me too. I love learning about the Reformed Churches too!
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          • #6
            Hi RevT - and welcome! I was raised in the Lutheran Church, was confirmed as a teenager. I don't know much about the Lutheran theology, but my husband and I get a real kick out of the Lutheran Satire videos.

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            • #7
              LOL...yes Patrick!

              I love them too.
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              • #8
                Lutheran Satire has a new site: Lutheran Satire | Welcome to the website, you poor soul.
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                • #9
                  My fave: A Latter Day Re-Gift | Lutheran Satire
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                  • #10
                    Hi RevT--I was baptized Lutheran way back in 1968, before there was the split within the Lutheran Church. I also married a Catholic shortly after my baptism, which further drew me away from the Lutheran Church, unfortunately. However, when I finally decided to go back to attending Lutheran services, and chose the Missouri Synod Lutheran Church near us here, it caused quite a bit of confusion for me as well as for the Church's staff. Since I had been baptized before the split, they couldn't decide if I should be allowed to partake of communion unless I had been reconfirmed. In order to do that I needed to agree to all of the Synods doctrines. However, I'd been a born again believer for so long, in spite of being married to a Catholic, that once I began reading all that I needed to agree with, I balked.

                    It was due to their not believing in a few things I'd come to believe in as a born again believer, one of which is the removal of the Bride of Christ by the Lord prior to the tribulation period, which was also something they didn't seem to believe in either. Due to the grief I was suffering back then over the loss of our son in the war in Afghanistan, once I encountered those problems I just told them I couldn't agree to agree with all that they believed and taught, and they were very nice about it all, and told me if I wanted to ever look into it all again that I'd be more than welcome to return. I almost did that at one point, but I just couldn't bring myself to involve myself one more time in anything that might cause me any more stress, conflict, or confusion at this point in my life. However, I love the Lutheran Church--Missouri Synod that is--and, long to be able to return to attending at least Sunday Church services. I now think that, deep down, I am actually looking for the strength to do just that. Is there any way you could help clarify some things about the doctrine for me? I'd be so grateful if you could!
                    God bless!
                    Christine
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                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Christine View Post
                      t was due to their not believing in a few things I'd come to believe in as a born again believer, one of which is the removal of the Bride of Christ by the Lord prior to the tribulation period, which was also something they didn't seem to believe in either.
                      Mark 13: 18 Pray that it may not happen in winter. 19 For in those days there will be such tribulation as has not been from the beginning of the creation that God created until now, and never will be. 20 And if the Lord had not cut short the days, no human being would be saved. But for the sake of the elect, whom he chose, he shortened the days.

                      The passage where "the Tribulation" comes from tells us with no uncertainty that the Elect, that is Christians, would be here throughout the Tribulation. There's not a verse or passage in all the Bible that even remotely hints at a Pretrib Rapture.

                      Matthew 24:37 For as were the days of Noah, so will be the coming of the Son of Man. 38 For as in those days before the flood they were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, until the day when Noah entered the ark, 39 and they were unaware until the flood came and swept them all away, so will be the coming of the Son of Man. 40 Then two men will be in the field; one will be taken and one left.

                      When Jesus speaks of what Pretribbers claim is the Rapture, Jesus is very clearly speaking about people being taken away by destruction for judgement, not raptured to be with Him. And, this taking away takes place during the tribulation, by means of the tribulation. It does not take place before the tribulation.

                      1 Thess 4 16 For the Lord himself will descend from heaven with a cry of command, with the voice of an archangel, and with the sound of the trumpet of God. And the dead in Christ will rise first. 17 Then we who are alive, who are left, will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air, and so we will always be with the Lord. 18 Therefore encourage one another with these words.

                      The passage where the "the Rapture" comes from says absolutely nothing about tribulation, let alone the timing of the rapture relative to the tribulation. The context of this "rapture" passage has nothing to do with avoiding tribulation and everything to do with us all being with the Lord and seeing our deceased loved ones again: 13 But we do not want you to be uninformed, brothers, about those who are asleep, that you may not grieve as others do who have no hope.

                      The Pretrib Rapture is an unbiblical doctrine that has invented in the 1800s and only became common in churches in the 20th century. It is a horrible doctrine that has done great harm to the church. And, you relating that it has caused you separation from a fine denomination is just another example of harm that doctrine has done.

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                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Christine View Post
                        However, I love the Lutheran Church--Missouri Synod that is--and, long to be able to return to attending at least Sunday Church services.
                        There's no reason you can't attend the services even if you aren't a member. I attended a Missouri Synod church for several months. I even considered joining the church but in the end I didn't because they believe in baptizing infants and I believe that only adults who have put their faith in Christ should be baptized.
                        Clyde Herrin's Blog
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                        • #13
                          Originally posted by theophilus View Post
                          There's no reason you can't attend the services even if you aren't a member. I attended a Missouri Synod church for several months. I even considered joining the church but in the end I didn't because they believe in baptizing infants and I believe that only adults who have put their faith in Christ should be baptized.
                          The Pretrib Rapture is anti-biblical and toxic to the church. I can't make the same charge against adult-only baptism, but I can charge advocates of adult-only baptism of causing unnecessary division in the church. The Bible doesn't teach adult-only baptism. And, baptism being the sign of a covenant relationship as was circumcision, infant baptism is implied. Infant baptism is implied again by the Bible telling us that whole households were baptized. And in Acts 2:38-39 baptism arguably is instructed for children. Also, infant baptism has been practiced as far back as the first century, and has been practically universal tradition of the church until the Post-Protestant Re-Reformation (the rise of Pentecostalism, Non-denominationalists, Mormonism, and the other usual suspects of generally bad doctrine).

                          If you don't believe in infant baptism for your children, a Lutheran church would be accommodating and baptize your offspring when they're older. But, the adult-only baptism churches won't respect the conscience of the people who would like their children baptized.

                          I would love to see anyone against infant baptism explain lucidly to me why in the Old Testament infants were circumcised. That'll never happen.

                          The reason the Lutheran Church practices infant baptism and doesn't teach the Pretrib Rapture is because this denomination was born and matured before the 1800s, back before the Post-Protestant Re-Reformation.

                          (It's now popular for people who know little about the English Bible, and who can't speak two words of a biblical language, to deem themselves experts on biblical doctrine. And, TV has given a platform for conmen to get rich teaching what people want to hear and teaching the most superficial and out-of-context understanding of scripture. E.g. "The Eunuch was baptized as an adult, so baptism is for adults." Never mind that this passage doesn't address the issue of infant baptism because the Eunuch wasn't raised in the church and would have equally been circumcised as an adult if he had converted to Judaism.)

                          The Missouri Synod of the Lutheran church is a good domination and anyone would do well to be a member of it.



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                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Cornelius View Post
                            If you don't believe in infant baptism for your children, a Lutheran church would be accommodating and baptize your offspring when they're older. But, the adult-only baptism churches won't respect the conscience of the people who would like their children baptized.
                            Or worse, they convey doubt to those that were baptized as children and teach that Covenant children should be rebaptized as the Ana-Baptist had.

                            Originally posted by Cornelius View Post
                            I would love to see anyone against infant baptism explain lucidly to me why in the Old Testament infants were circumcised. That'll never happen.
                            It doesn't take rocket science to understand that Covenant and Credo-Baptism are not the same thing. Often I come across debates where neither side even acknowledges the opposing argument whatsoever, because they keep talking past one another. They can't even agree upon the definition let alone the mode(s) of baptism.

                            God bless,
                            William
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                            • #15
                              Originally posted by William View Post
                              Or worse, they convey doubt to those that were baptized as children and teach that Covenant children should be rebaptized as the Ana-Baptist had.

                              Yes, they're legalistic. If you did it "wrong" it does't count and you have to redo it. They'll even demand that adults who acted in good faith and after a confession of faith be rebaptized if it was done "wrong."

                              Legalism aside, those against infant baptism don't see baptism as an analogue to circumcision, a representation of a covenant relationship. They see baptism as a public declaration of faith. Regardless of how baptism was done in the Bible, I don't think they understand the biblical purpose of either circumcision or baptism.



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