1John 2:26,27 Listening to the Spirit

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  • 1John 2:26,27 Listening to the Spirit

    Listening to the Spirit

    1John 2:26,27 I am writing these things to you about those who are trying to lead you astray. As for you, the anointing you received from him remains in you, and you do not need anyone to teach you. But as his anointing teaches you about all things and as that anointing is real, not counterfeit— just as it has taught you, remain in him.

    Jesus said, "When he, the Spirit of truth, comes, he will guide you into all truth." John 16:13 and furthermore promised, "The Counselor, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in my name, will teach you all things and will remind you of everything I have said to you." John 14:26 Thus when those born of God hear the truth, the Spirit confirms it in our conscience. We embrace truth as a sheep listens to the voice of its shepherd, as Jesus said, "My sheep listen to my voice." John 10:27

    So I have confidence that those who are of a like Spirit will listen and understand, and cease listening to those who would lead you astray concerning these matters.

  • #2
    Can YOU Tell Me Why I LOVE Jesus ?
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    • #3
      Originally posted by sataish View Post
      Can YOU Tell Me Why I LOVE Jesus ?
      Because He first loved you?

      God bless,
      William
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      • #4
        Originally posted by bcbsr View Post
        Listening to the Spirit

        1John 2:26,27 I am writing these things to you about those who are trying to lead you astray. As for you, the anointing you received from him remains in you, and you do not need anyone to teach you. But as his anointing teaches you about all things and as that anointing is real, not counterfeit— just as it has taught you, remain in him.

        Jesus said, "When he, the Spirit of truth, comes, he will guide you into all truth." John 16:13 and furthermore promised, "The Counselor, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in my name, will teach you all things and will remind you of everything I have said to you." John 14:26 Thus when those born of God hear the truth, the Spirit confirms it in our conscience. We embrace truth as a sheep listens to the voice of its shepherd, as Jesus said, "My sheep listen to my voice." John 10:27

        So I have confidence that those who are of a like Spirit will listen and understand, and cease listening to those who would lead you astray concerning these matters.
        To correctly interpret scripture you need to take account of the context in which it was written.

        John 16:13 & 14:26 were spoken to the apostles, the leaders of his Church. They were not a promise to lead every Christian into all truth. We only have to look at the myriads of different doctrines among Christians to see that.

        1John 2:26,27 also needs to be looked at in context. Let’s back up a bit from those two verses.

        John is writing to Christians who he personally has catechised, taught them everything, taught them the truth. He addresses them as “my children” (vs 1) and “beloved” (vs 7). However they are in danger of being led astray by false teachers. That is the context. And we need to start at vs 20 not 24 to get the immediate context

        20. But you have been anointed by the Holy One, and you all know.
        Footnotes say some manuscripts say “you know everything” instead of you all know.
        They know because John has taught them.

        21 I write to you, not because you do not know the truth, but because you know it.. [because John has taught them].

        24 Let what you heard from the beginning abide in you[what they have already been taught]. If what you heard from the beginning abides in you, then you will abide in the Son and in the Father.

        Now we come to vs 26&27

        26 I write this to you about those who would deceive you [John is concerned that they are being taught falsely].

        27 but the anointing which you received from him abides in you, and you have no need that any one should teach you [because they have already been taught by John]; as his anointing teaches you about everything [that they have been taught], and is true, and is no lie, just as it has taught you, abide in him.

        This is equivalent to the promises Jesus made to the apostles in Jn 14:26. The Holy Spirit would bring to mind all the true teaching they had already received. That presupposes that they had already received true teaching. But you have to get that true teaching first. You cannot generate it from your own resources. You cannot reach the truth by starting from scratch, but only by receiving it from those who have already been taught it and can pass it on. Then when you are presented with false teaching, the Holy Spirit will bring to mind the truth that you have already been taught.
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        • #5
          Even if one were "taught" by the apostles, doesn't guarantee they'd get it right, unless they have the Holy Spirit, which is the anointing John is talking about.

          1Cor 2:12 We have not received the spirit of the world but the Spirit who is from God, that we may understand what God has freely given us.
          13 This is what we speak, not in words taught us by human wisdom but in words taught by the Spirit, expressing spiritual truths in spiritual words.
          14 The man without the Spirit does not accept the things that come from the Spirit of God, for they are foolishness to him, and he cannot understand them, because they are spiritually discerned.

          Lots of people read the apostle's teaching in their epistles, but don't get it.
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          • #6
            Originally posted by Bede View Post

            27 but the anointing which you received from him abides in you, and you have no need that any one should teach you [because they have already been taught by John]; as his anointing teaches you about everything [that they have been taught],
            It seems to me that your parenthetical remark is off the mark. It's not as you imply that they don't need to be taught by the Holy Spirit because they've "already been taught by John", as you say, but that the Holy Spirit himself is actively involved in teaching them. And this is the experience those born of God have in their relationship with the Holy Spirit. The Holy Spirit gives us the proper sense in which to interpret the Bible, for example, and the discernment as to its application in our lives without having to be dictated to as under the law. Those who rely purely upon indoctrination without question often end up being led astray into deviant denominational theologies.
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            • #7
              Originally posted by bcbsr View Post
              Even if one were "taught" by the apostles, doesn't guarantee they'd get it right, unless they have the Holy Spirit, which is the anointing John is talking about.

              1Cor 2:12 We have not received the spirit of the world but the Spirit who is from God, that we may understand what God has freely given us.
              13 This is what we speak, not in words taught us by human wisdom but in words taught by the Spirit, expressing spiritual truths in spiritual words.
              14 The man without the Spirit does not accept the things that come from the Spirit of God, for they are foolishness to him, and he cannot understand them, because they are spiritually discerned.

              Lots of people read the apostle's teaching in their epistles, but don't get it.
              Having the Holy Spirit doesn’t guarantee you will get it right either. That’s why Jesus left a Church to be the “pillar and bulwark of the truth” (1Tim 3:15).
              Comment>

              • #8
                Originally posted by bcbsr View Post

                It seems to me that your parenthetical remark is off the mark. It's not as you imply that they don't need to be taught by the Holy Spirit because they've "already been taught by John", as you say, but that the Holy Spirit himself is actively involved in teaching them. And this is the experience those born of God have in their relationship with the Holy Spirit. The Holy Spirit gives us the proper sense in which to interpret the Bible, for example, and the discernment as to its application in our lives without having to be dictated to as under the law.
                Everybody thinking all they need is themselves and the Holy Spirit to arrive at the truth is why we have 30,000 different Protestant denominations and one pastor churches, teaching conflicting doctrines.

                Originally posted by bcbsr View Post
                Those who rely purely upon indoctrination without question often end up being led astray into deviant denominational theologies.
                A straw man argument.
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                • #9
                  And I am part of the "Church". But the "visible", or shall I say "popular Church" is not the body of Christ. The Catholic Church, for example, is filled with heretical doctrines and doesn't allow itself to be scrutinized by "the Church". Notice how the Bereans were honored for scrutinizing even the apostle Paul. "Now the Bereans were of more noble character than the Thessalonians, for they received the message with great eagerness and examined the Scriptures every day to see if what Paul said was true." Acts 17:11, but in post-Biblical christianity Bereans have largely been reckon pariahs.

                  The Bible doesn't advocate mindlessly believing whatever you are told. Rather "The spiritual man makes judgments about all things"

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                  • #10
                    Originally posted by bcbsr View Post
                    And I am part of the "Church". But the "visible", or shall I say "popular Church" is not the body of Christ. The Catholic Church, for example, is filled with heretical doctrines and doesn't allow itself to be scrutinized by "the Church". Notice how the Bereans were honored for scrutinizing even the apostle Paul. "Now the Bereans were of more noble character than the Thessalonians, for they received the message with great eagerness and examined the Scriptures every day to see if what Paul said was true." Acts 17:11, but in post-Biblical christianity Bereans have largely been reckon pariahs.

                    The Bible doesn't advocate mindlessly believing whatever you are told. Rather "The spiritual man makes judgments about all things"
                    What was that little rant all about?
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                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Bede View Post

                      What was that little rant all about?
                      It was about the importance of basing your beliefs on what the Bible says rather than on what your church teaches.
                      Clyde Herrin's Blog
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                      • #12
                        Originally posted by theophilus View Post

                        It was about the importance of basing your beliefs on what the Bible says rather than on what your church teaches.
                        Why do you think you should base you beliefs on your personal and fallible interpretations of scripture rather than the Church which is the "pillar and bulwark of the truth"?

                        Where does scripture teach that?
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                        • #13
                          Seems you need some basic reading comprehension skills. As I said, we differ on what we consider "The Church".
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                          • #14
                            Originally posted by bcbsr View Post
                            Seems you need some basic reading comprehension skills.
                            I think resorting to personal attacks is a sign you have lost the argument.

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                            • #15
                              Originally posted by bcbsr View Post
                              And I am part of the "Church". But the "visible", or shall I say "popular Church" is not the body of Christ. The Catholic Church, for example, is filled with heretical doctrines and doesn't allow itself to be scrutinized by "the Church". Notice how the Bereans were honored for scrutinizing even the apostle Paul. "Now the Bereans were of more noble character than the Thessalonians, for they received the message with great eagerness and examined the Scriptures every day to see if what Paul said was true." Acts 17:11, but in post-Biblical christianity Bereans have largely been reckon pariahs.

                              The Bible doesn't advocate mindlessly believing whatever you are told. Rather "The spiritual man makes judgments about all things"
                              Just adding to this, and linking to a topic on this subject:

                              What do we mean when we make the distinction between the visible and invisible church? And what is the reason for this distinction? Starting around the 4th century - the expression "Visible Church" was refered to by theologians, not to a building, but to the members on the rolls of a local church. In other words, all persons who are members of a local church are considered to be a part of the visible church.

                              On the other hand, the invisible church refers to those persons who have actually been regenerated or quickened by the Holy Spirit, God's elect or true believers. Augustine referred to the church as a mixed body, a visible people, but this people has both tares and wheat, as described by Jesus. In other words, there is no such thing as a perfect church, and there will always people in the church there with bad motives or are there for the wrong reason. There will always be people who claim to love Christ but whose heart is far from Him. Many, Jesus says, will say on that day, did we not do this and that in your name? Jesus will then say, "I never knew you". These are descriptions of some people now sitting in your local church and Jesus says of them that he "never knew them!!!" Some persons are in church for show, to be seen by men as pious, others perhaps for a social club or to show of their ability to wax eloquent when discussing theology. These persons hearts are completely invisible to us, but of course, they are not invisible to God and only He can know who is truly regenerate, so we must be generous in our judgements.
                              The Visible Vs. The Invisible Church -Christforums
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