Gospel of John

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  • Gospel of John

    The moderators suggested that I should read the Gospel of John.

    John says that God is the Word. (John 1:1) He does not say which word. Maybe he means word like dictionary or lexicon or vocabulary.

    Then John says that this bit of grammar made all things. Actually, he says, "All things were made through him ... " (John 1:3)

    At this point I, like totally, need to say that if I had written "All things were made ..." Ms Bee, my English teacher, would have, like totally, circled it in red which a big AV (for active voice) next to it.

    As I understand about pagans, we normally think that the gods came into existence after creation. John appears to think that the creator god existed before creation.

    Llola

  • #2
    Originally posted by Llola View Post
    John says that God is the Word. (John 1:1) He does not say which word. Maybe he means word like dictionary or lexicon or vocabulary.
    Hi Llola,

    In John 1:1 the "Word" is an English translation from Greek for "Logos". Here are some great commentaries on the subject:

    God bless,
    William
    Comment>

    • #3
      Originally posted by Llola View Post
      John appears to think that the creator god existed before creation.
      If the creator God didn't exist before creation how could there have been a creation in the first place?
      Clyde Herrin's Blog
      Comment>

      • #4
        Originally posted by William View Post

        Hi Llola,

        In John 1:1 the "Word" is an English translation from Greek for "Logos". Here are some great commentaries on the subject:
        God bless,
        William

        In school we learn that logos means logic, which is one method of argument. In this case it must be more complicated. I'll try to digest what you wrote. It might turn out to be above my pay grade.

        Llola
        Last edited by Llola; 01-31-2016, 05:44 PM.
        Comment>

        • #5
          Originally posted by theophilus View Post
          If the creator God didn't exist before creation how could there have been a creation in the first place?

          In my creation myth, the sky, sea, and some of the gods exist at the beginning of the myth. I don't believe it has an explanation about which came first, the universe or the gods.

          Llola
          Comment>

          • #6
            I’m trying to understand about Logos, but I think I can say that the Word or the Logos held, or as my grandmother (she’s a lawyer) would say, possessed and seized life, which held light in the darkness, a metaphor for good surrounded by evil like a street light at the corner of Exposition and Figueroa in Los Angeles. (John 1:4-5)

            So, in the Christian view, we live in a world surrounded with evil like in the movie, Star Wars. Or not, since I really don’t understand about logos.

            Llola
            Comment>

            • #7
              Originally posted by Llola View Post
              Then John says that this bit of grammar made all things. Actually, he says, "All things were made through him ... " (John 1:3)

              At this point I, like totally, need to say that if I had written "All things were made ..." Ms Bee, my English teacher, would have, like totally, circled it in red which a big AV (for active voice) next to it.

              1) Grammar styles are culturally dependent. It's uneducated to impose American English standards on other languages, especially on an ancient Hebrew text. I'm sure Ms Be knows better.
              2) Our English Bibles are translations. If you fault the grammar used by the translators, take it up with the room of language PhDs behind good translations. For Bible study, the grammar is irrelevant if the meaning is clear.
              3) All grammar rules are made to be broken.
              4) I'd love to see how you'd reword "All things were made through him" in "active voice" without producing something clumsy.

              If you want to fight over the simple stuff, what will you do with deeper things? In the beginning, God is portrayed as speaking things into existence. The essence of these words is God.



              Comment>

              • #8
                Originally posted by theophilus View Post
                If the creator God didn't exist before creation how could there have been a creation in the first place?
                A common stupid (aren't they all) argument of Atheists is to accuse Christians of being Atheists for not believing in gods like Zeus. Zeus isn't God. Zeus is a created being, comparable to a super-human. Nothing that comes after Creation can be God. Besides, it's absolutely irrelevant that one doesn't believe in any god that is not the God of Creation and the God of Abraham.
                Comment>

                • #9
                  Originally posted by Cornelius View Post


                  1) Grammar styles are culturally dependent. It's uneducated to impose American English standards on other languages, especially on an ancient Hebrew text. I'm sure Ms Be knows better.
                  2) Our English Bibles are translations. If you fault the grammar used by the translators, take it up with the room of language PhDs behind good translations. For Bible study, the grammar is irrelevant if the meaning is clear.
                  3) All grammar rules are made to be broken.
                  4) I'd love to see how you'd reword "All things were made through him" in "active voice" without producing something clumsy.

                  If you want to fight over the simple stuff, what will you do with deeper things? In the beginning, God is portrayed as speaking things into existence. The essence of these words is God.



                  I'm sorry. I don't want to fight. I meant no disrespect. I'm sorry,
                  Comment>

                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Llola View Post
                    I really don’t understand about logos.
                    You don't have to understand the logos in order to understand the rest of the gospel of John. When you read the Bible for the first time you will probably find a lot of things you don't understand. The best thing to do would be to focus on the parts you do understand. If you put into practice what you understand God will give you the ability to understand the parts that now seem to difficult.
                    Clyde Herrin's Blog
                    Comment>

                    • #11
                      I had thought that I had totally messed up, but like my mother says, “Te quedas flaquita porque se llegas ejercicio de saltar a ideas malos.” (You stay skinny because you get exercise by jumping to conclusions.)

                      I don’t know anything about Ms B’s religion, except that she uses Yiddish words, so maybe she’s Jewish. Now that I have thought about it, she might object if I wrote, “The Word was God,” because she objects to people using the verb, to be.

                      But back to John

                      John, the author of the Gospel of John, tells us that John, the man who baptized people in Bethany, predicted the coming of “one who comes after … ,“ who must, like totally, be Jesus.

                      When I learned about this at a Sunday School, John the Baptizer baptized Jesus, but John the Author doesn’t mention Jesus’ baptism, at least not yet.(John 6-34)

                      John the Baptist and John the Author have the same middle name as Kermit T Frog from Sesame Street.

                      Llola
                      Comment>

                      • #12
                        Jesus finds four disciples, Andrew, Philip, Nathanael, and Simon.. (John 1:35-51). Normally he has twelve, so he must find more later. Jesus changes Simon’s name to Cephas, which means Peter, so Simon must later become Saint Peter.


                        Llola
                        Comment>

                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Llola View Post
                          When I learned about this at a Sunday School, John the Baptizer baptized Jesus, but John the Author doesn’t mention Jesus’ baptism, at least not yet.(John 6-34)
                          The other three gospels all record the baptism of Jesus and tell how afterward he went into the wilderness to fast for 40 days after which he was tempted by Satan. When he first appears in John's gospel, in verse 29, he is apparently returning from his time in the wilderness.

                          Jesus changes Simon’s name to Cephas, which means Peter, so Simon must later become Saint Peter.
                          He is the person who is often called Saint Peter but he is never called that in the Bible. We generally think of a saint as being someone who is morally superior to the general run of humanity but in the Bible the word saint refers to anyone who have repented of his sins and put his faith in Jesus. Perhaps this will help you understand the difference:

                          How to become a saint | clydeherrin

                          Originally posted by Llola View Post
                          John the Baptist and John the Author have the same middle name as Kermit T Frog from Sesame Street.
                          I had never noticed that! :D
                          Clyde Herrin's Blog
                          Comment>

                          • #14
                            Originally posted by theophilus View Post
                            When he first appears in John's gospel, in verse 29, he is apparently returning from his time in the wilderness.
                            So, possibly the other gospels describe one event, and John describe a latter event?
                            Comment>

                            • #15
                              Jesus goes to Galilee. He attends a wedding during which he turns water into wine. In my own brand of pagan religion I don’t know of any gods turning water to wine, but in Greek Mythology, Dionysus squeezed the first wine. Saint John must have written his Gospel with Greeks as a possible audience, so changing water into wine would have been a way to get their attention. (John 2:1-12)

                              My Italian relatives turn water into wine, or so they claim. After they make wine with grapes, they add sugar and water to the leftovers.. The mixture produces a second batch of wine.

                              My little sister has a favorite wine. “I want to go to Disneyland.”
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